Is Christianity the religion of peace and love or the religion of revenge and terror?

[عثمان أحمد الشيخ]

* You said :" the Bible is not just one single book. It is actually a collection of 66 books, which is called the canon of scriptures. These 66 books contain a variety of genres.
1- Do you believe that all the Bible "the word of God" or the 66 books are attributed to their authors?.
2- Do you believe that the Old Testament and the New Testament are the two parts of the Bible and they are the words of God as all Christians believe ?
3- Are you sure that all the Bibles all over the world 66 books? I think that in the single-family you can see the version of the father is different from the version of the mother and the version of the son is different from the version of the daughter . In my poor knowledge every sect has its own Bible such as:
The Copy of the Protestants is 66 chapters
The copy of the Catholicos is 73 chapters
The copy of the Greek Orthodox is 75 chapters
The copy of the Ethiopian Orthodox is 81 chapters
The copy of the east Orthodox in Eastern Europe is 87 chapters
--- Which of these Bibles is the word of God? Please tell me if you can.Who added and who removed from The Holy Bible?
--- Also there are a lot of verses were removed from " the New International Version" Please read the introduction of the bible and check the verses .Also revise the New Revised Standard Version . You will see a lot of verses that were moved from the Bible because they are not found in the oldest manuscripts.Who added these verses? !!!!!
* You said :" these 66 books were written by 40 different authors over 1500 years, in 3 different languages, on 3 different continents And most of these authors never knew one another personally. "
1- Then the Bible is a human made written by 40 authors who do not know each other.That justifies the big mistakes, the terrible contradictions and the scientific errors in the Bible. Do not say that they wrote the Bible with the help of the Holy Spirit !!!!!! Why do you say that the Bible is the word of God? I am waiting for you anwer to my questions ......

[pandora]

I will endeavour to answer your questions to the best of my ability.

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* You said :" the Bible is not just one single book. It is actually a collection of 66 books, which is called the canon of scriptures. These 66 books contain a variety of genres.
1- Do you believe that all the Bible "the word of God" or the 66 books are attributed to their authors?.

Christians believe the Bible to be the inspired word of God. This is what the Bible claims for itself we have no reason to doubt Gods purpose or question His divine methods. Do you mean were the books penned by the Prophets they are attributed to? Many prophets did pen there own revelation many employed scribes.. Do you believe that if a book is penned by a scribe and not the author directly this somehow effects the content of the book? May I ask what method did Mohammed employ to ensure the scribes recorded his words accurately? Was the whole of the Quran collected together in the form it is today during his lifetime? I'm sure you have no cause to doubt that the scribes that penned the Quran took the utmost care with their work as they believed the work they did was to the glory of God. Why would you suppose any different for the biblical scribes? They also believed their work was to the glory of God.

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2- Do you believe that the Old Testament and the New Testament are the two parts of the Bible and they are the words of God as all Christians believe ?

I'm not sure I understand your question here. The Old Testament is part of the Jewish scriptures and contain the Torah "laws"the New Testament or Gospel is the account of Jesus the messiah His birth, mission, earthly death and resurrection. We believe they contain the inspired message of God and an historical account of the creation, fall of man and mans redemption a gradual chronological order of the unfolding of Gods plane for mankind. Christians like muslims will at times interpret the same message differently. Yet the core belief is the same.

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3- Are you sure that all the Bibles all over the world 66 books? I think that in the single-family you can see the version of the father is different from the version of the mother and the version of the son is different from the version of the daughter . In my poor knowledge every sect has its own Bible such as:
The Copy of the Protestants is 66 chapters
The copy of the Catholicos is 73 chapters
The copy of the Greek Orthodox is 75 chapters
The copy of the Ethiopian Orthodox is 81 chapters
The copy of the east Orthodox in Eastern Europe is 87 chapters

your knowledge is not poor in this respect, no doubt you have checked your information above and so you can also easily find out why different branches of Christianity include different numbers of books in their Bible. When you say chapters they are in fact books.. Christians of whatever branch will always have the same 66 books, why some seem to have more books than 66 in common use are because they include the Deuterocanonical or the Apocrypha. These books have always been available they have not been deleted or added, there has been disagreement amongst Biblical Scholars as to weather they contain the inspired word of God. The nature of the books in question and weather they are there or not, does not detract from the message the 66 books in common use tell. Your point about family and different Bibles.. The Bibles are the same they are translations, translations will only differ in minor textual matter which again in no way detracts from the message. You have different translations of the Quran, there may be minor textual differences but again the message remains constant.

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--- Which of these Bibles is the word of God? Please tell me if you can.Who added and who removed from The Holy Bible?
--- Also there are a lot of verses were removed from " the New International Version" Please read the introduction of the bible and check the verses .Also revise the New Revised Standard Version . You will see a lot of verses that were moved from the Bible because they are not found in the oldest manuscripts.Who added these verses? !!!!!

What constitutes a "lot of verses". If they were not found in the oldest manuscripts then it's right they should be removed. Personally I don't like the King James Version, no doubt he though he was doing a good thing and in a way he was because he brought the bible to people who had not had access to it before. and a chance to own their own copy. He made it his life's work but he did not use original manuscripts but translations. As more knowledge became available then it was revised. I have no idea who moved what when. Do you know about the copies of the Quran the Uthman destroyed? I mean, if all other copies at the time were destroyed how can you be sure something was not left out or the odd word added here or there? This has to come down to faith.. Just as you have faith that Allah protected his word in the Quran I have the same faith that God protects His word in the Bible.

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* You said :" these 66 books were written by 40 different authors over 1500 years, in 3 different languages, on 3 different continents And most of these authors never knew one another personally. "
1- Then the Bible is a human made written by 40 authors who do not know each other.That justifies the big mistakes, the terrible contradictions and the scientific errors in the Bible. Do not say that they wrote the Bible with the help of the Holy Spirit !!!!!! Why do you say that the Bible is the word of God? I am waiting for you anwer to my questions ......

The Bible was written by the guidance of the Holy Spirit weather you believe it or not is immaterial. Jesus is Gods eternal word He promised he would send the spirit to guide the apostles to ensure His word reached all mankind, this he did. There are no ...big mistakes, terrible contradictions, scientific errors as you see them to be. We do not say the Bible is the word of God verbatim, as you claim for the Quran. We claim it is the inspired word of God.. Scripture is God breathed we know this and as we know God we trust His word... Jesus Christ.

[عثمان أحمد الشيخ]

Dear Pandora,
Thank you for your answers. I have many comments on them but I think that we have opened many issues and topics in general.What about if we discuss each individual issue to make the discussion so useful and fruitful for both of us. Of course, you have all right to agree or disagree with all my appreciation and respect.Also you have all right to continue or not continue at any time.I suggest that we start with the issue of the Godhood of Jesus (peace be upon him) . Many years ago, I visited two monasteries in the desert.The Monk gave us a lecture to know the Christian faith.He said directly and explicitly "And we Christian believe that Jesus is our God". In fact, it was a big shock to hear that "so I began to study the Bible.
-- By the way.There is only one version of the Holy Quran in Arabic for more than 1400 years since the time of Muhammad (peace be upon him). You should know that the Holy Quran descended on Muhammad through "Jibril" the angle of Allah throughout 23 years.Some companions of the messengers memorized The Holy Quran by heart.The Holy Quran was written in pottery or some bones or some of skins of animals and was reviewed by Jibril and Muhammad once a year .In the year that the messenger died Jibril reviewed the Quran with him two times.Osman (May Allah be pleased with him ) collected all the Holy Quran in one book . He united the Umma of Islam on one book .On one writing what is called " Osmany drawing " so the Holy Quran is one in every part in that world. .Yes, the Holy Quran was translated into many languages . We Muslims do not call them " the translation of the Holy Quran " because there are differences in translations" but we call them " the translation of the meaning of the Holy Quran" to be more accurately.Thank you and peace on you .

[pandora]

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Dear Pandora,
Thank you for your answers. I have many comments on them but I think that we have opened many issues and topics in general.What about if we discuss each individual issue to make the discussion so useful and fruitful for both of us. Of course, you have all right to agree or disagree with all my appreciation and respect.Also you have all right to continue or not continue at any time.I suggest that we start with the issue of the Godhood of Jesus (peace be upon him) . Many years ago, I visited two monasteries in the desert.The Monk gave us a lecture to know the Christian faith.He said directly and explicitly "And we Christian believe that Jesus is our God". In fact, it was a big shock to hear that "so I began to study the Bible.

As you please, I am always agreeable to respectful dialogue with the aim for better mutual understanding. I wish for you to understand that I am not here to win hearts and minds to Christianity.. :) I would not wish to waste my time, as I believe we are all guided by Gods Spirit alone and it is not our place to enforce our beliefs upon others. People followed Jesus by choice He never put people under obligation trusting only in God, I endeavour to follow in His gracious footsteps. I only wish to clarify a Christians belief in their scriptures, as I see many muslims believe many different things about the Christian faith which are not true. I do not see where such views of Christianity that muslims hold today stem from... I do not believe your prophet Mohammed thought thus... And these misconceptions have developed over centuries put forth by misinformed muslims with maybe an agenda of their own.. Who knows it may be a possibility.

I can can understand it would have been a great shock for you to be told so bluntly that we see Jesus as God, I would have hoped the monks would have taken the time to explain why this is so, if they did, then maybe they did not do so as well as they could have or it could just be that it is a concept that a muslim is just not equipped to deal with.. I can appreciate that as it goes against all you have ever been told and is contrary to Islam. I commend you for your study of the Bible, yet without spiritual guidance I feel it a difficult task to come to full understanding as you already must see it from another perspective and it will be impossible for you to not compare it with your accepted truth.. The Quran. I say this because it is what I find personally when reading the Quran... Much does not make sense to me and I find it difficult to see it as a final revelation after the Bible because on so many issues it appears to me to be diametrically opposed to what I know from the Bible. This is a daunting task to make sense for each I feel and that's why I see interfaith dialogue as important to find a common ground where we can exist in friendship.

I will endeavour to answer your queries on the Godhead or divinity of Christ to the best of my ability and understanding. Maybe you would like to start a thread accordingly.

Peace upon you.

[عثمان أحمد الشيخ]

Dear Pandora,
1- In the name of Allah the Beneficent and Merciful.I hope that we discuss the matters with all friendliness, respect , candor and clarity.Without any hatred or any arrogance or any despising because we are all the children of Adam and Eve.We always forget that we are all brothers and sisters.The Almighty Allah (praise be to him) created us and made us nations and tribes to know each other.To spread peace among ourselves . This is an appeal declared in the Qur'an. Allah says in the Holy Quran :-
"O mankind! we created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and Tribes, that ye may know Each other (Not that ye may despise (each other). Verily the Most honoured of you In the sight of Allah is (He who is) the Most righteous of you. and Allah has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things)" (49/13)
-- This declaration is for all mankind all over the world. The most honoured people in the sight of Allah not the most beautiful or the most interesting or the most wealthy or the strongest no but the most righteous ,pure pious and devout.Allah does not look at our images or shapes but He (pbth) look at our hearts.The righteous people always have pure hearts.They always fear Allah and love all his creatures.
2- Allah (pbth) taught us how to treat with each other and how to spread peace and love with each other . Allah says in the Holy Quran :- " O ye who believe! let not some men among you laugh at others: it may be that the (latter) are better than the (former): nor let some women laugh at others: it may be that the (latter are better than the (former): nor defame nor be sarcastic to Each other, nor call Each other by (offensive) nicknames: . seeming is a name connoting wickedness, (to be used of one) after He has believed: and those who do not desist are (indeed) doing wrong. 12. O ye who believe! avoid suspicion As much (as possible): for suspicion In some cases is a sin: and spy not on Each other behind their backs. would any of you like to eat the flesh of His dead brother? Nay, ye would abhor it...But fear Allah. for Allah is Oft-Returning, Most Merciful.(49/11-12)
--- These are some principles that Allah (pbth) taught us .If I do well that is by the grace of Allah and his support.And if I do bad that is by my ignorance and the support of the accursed Satan. Oh my God. Shield us from the evils of ourselves and our bad deeds.
3- As you see Jesus (peace be upon him) as God or a son of God. Please ,Trust me this is a serious saying. Excuse me this is the eye of blasphemy and infidelity .This saying is the biggest insult to the Almighty God .It will never make Jesus (pbuh) happy,on the contrary it makes him very sad and very afraid to the state of his followers that overestimated and exaggerated in his love that they make him God. All evidences in the Bible deny the divinty of Jesus.Please refer to my article under the title " God is one in the Torah,in the Bible and in the Quran.Also track all the sayings of Jesus himself that ends with the phrase " who sent me " .In these sayings he confirmed that he is a messenger of Allah .Allah sent him to guide people to know and worship the only true God of that universe.Please tell me one only verse in the Bible that Jesus said "I am God worship me"
4- I will tell you the opinion of The Holy Quran (the last revelation in that world ) about the phrase "son of God" (and of course you are free to believe or not believe .To read them or not.To say I am not intrested or not)
68. They say: "(Allah) hath begotten a son!" - glory be to Him! He is self-sufficient! His are all things In the heavens and on earth! no warrant have ye for this! say ye about Allah what ye know not?
69. Say: "Those who invent a lie against Allah will never prosper."
70. A Little enjoyment In This world!- and then, to us will be their return, then shall we make them taste the severest penalty for their blasphemies.(10/68-70)

88. They say: "((Allah)) Most gracious has begotten a son!"
89. Indeed ye have put forth a thing Most monstrous!
90. At it the skies are ready to burst, the earth to split asunder, and the mountains to fall down In utter ruin,
91. That They should invoke a son for ((Allah)) Most Gracious.
92. For it is not consonant with the majesty of ((Allah)) Most gracious that He should beget a son.
93. Not one of the beings In the heavens and the earth but must come to ((Allah)) Most gracious As a servant.
94. He does take an account of them (all), and hath numbered them (all) exactly.
95. And everyone of them will come to Him singly on the Day of Judgment. (19/88-95)
26. And They say: "((Allah)) Most gracious has begotten offspring." glory to Him! They are (but) servants raised to honour.
27. They speak not before He speaks, and They act (in all things) by His command.
28. He knows what is before them, and what is behind them, and They offer no intercession except for those who are acceptable, and They stand In awe and reverence of His (Glory).
29. If any of them should say, "I am a god besides Him", such a one we should reward with Hell: Thus do we reward those who do wrong. (21/26-29)

to be continued

[عثمان أحمد الشيخ]

5- Also I will tell you what the Holy Quran said about trinity and the saying " Jesus is God". The Almighty Allah (pbth) confirms that Jesus (pbuh) is a prophet as all prophets that Allah sent to mankind to guide them to way of Allah.Allah said in the Holy Quran :-


A) - 171. O people of the Book! Commit no excesses In your religion: nor say of Allah aught but the Truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) an apostle of Allah, and His Word, which He bestowed on Mary, and a spirit proceeding from him: so believe In Allah and His apostles. say not "Trinity" : desist: it will be better for you: for Allah is one Allah. glory be to him: (far Exalted is He) above having a son. to Him belong all things In the heavens and on earth. and Enough is Allah As a disposer of affairs.
172. Christ disdaineth nor to serve and worship Allah, nor do the angels, those nearest (to Allah.: those who Disdain His worship and are arrogant,-He will gather them all together unto Himself to (answer).(4/171-172)

B) -- 77. Say: "O people of the Book! exceed not In your Religion the bounds (of what is proper), trespassing beyond the truth, nor follow the vain desires of people who went wrong In times gone by,- who misled many, and strayed (themselves) from the Even way.(5/77)

C) -- 75. Christ the son of Mary was no more than an apostle; many were the apostles that passed away before Him. His mother was a woman of Truth. They had both to eat their (daily) food. see How Allah doth make His Signs Clear to them; yet see In what ways They are deluded away from the truth!
76. Say: "Will ye worship, besides Allah, something which hath no power either to harm or benefit you? but Allah,- He it is that heareth and knoweth all things."(5/75-76)
--- Jesus was a messenger and his mother was pure and righteous.They were eating food and that means that they were humans.Jesus is not God because God never eat or drink or sleep or die and so on.

D) -- 17. In blasphemy indeed are those that say that Allah is Christ the son of Mary. say: "Who then hath the least power against Allah, if His will were to destroy Christ the son of Mary, His mother, and all every - one that is on the earth? for to Allah belongeth the dominion of the heavens and the earth, and all that is between. He createth what He pleaseth. for Allah hath power over all things."(5/17)
--- The saying " Jesus is god " is the eye of blasphemy . There in no God but God.He is the only true God of that universe.

E) --72. They do blaspheme who say: "(Allah) is Christ the son of Mary." but said Christ: "O Children of Israel! worship Allah, My Lord and your Lord." Whoever joins other gods with Allah,- Allah will forbid Him the garden, and the Fire will be His abode. there will for the wrong-doers be no one to help (5/72)
--- Jesus said in the Bible " my God and your God. He invited his followers to know and worship the only true God who sent him to people.


F) --73. They do blaspheme who say: Allah is one of three In a Trinity: for there is no god except one Allah. if They desist not from their word (of blasphemy), Verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them.
74. Why turn They not to Allah, and seek His forgiveness? for Allah is Oft- forgiving, Most Merciful. (5/73-74)

--- Allah (pbth) told us that the following dialouge will be happen between the Almighty Allah and Jesus (pbuh) in the day of resurrection.Allah (pbth) will ask Jesus if he told his followers that he is a god and his mother (and Allah knows everything but He wants his followers to hear Jesus' answers).In that day every messenger will be the witness of his people . And we all will stand in front of the Almighty Allah alone .Allah says in the Holy Quran :-

G)--116. And Behold! Allah will say: "O Jesus the son of Mary! Didst Thou say unto men, worship me and My mother As gods In derogation of Allah.?" He will say: "Glory to Thee! never could I say what I had no right (to say). had I said such a thing, Thou wouldst indeed have known it. Thou Knowest what is In My heart, Thou I know not what is In Thine. for Thou Knowest In full all that is hidden.
117. "Never said I to them aught except what Thou Didst command me to say, to wit, 'worship Allah, My Lord and your Lord'; and I was a witness over them whilst I dwelt amongst them; when Thou Didst take me up Thou wast the Watcher over them, and Thou art a witness to all things.
118. "If Thou dost punish them, They are Thy servant: if Thou dost forgive them, Thou art the Exalted In power, the Wise."
119. Allah will say: "This is a Day on which the truthful will profit from their truth: theirs are Gardens, with rivers flowing beneath,- their eternal home: Allah well-pleased with them, and They with Allah. that is the great salvation, (the fulfilment of all desires). (5/116-119)

[pandora]

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Dear Pandora,
1- In the name of Allah the Beneficent and Merciful.I hope that we discuss the matters with all friendliness, respect , candor and clarity.Without any hatred or any arrogance or any despising because we are all the children of Adam and Eve.We always forget that we are all brothers and sisters.The Almighty Allah (praise be to him) created us and made us nations and tribes to know each other.To spread peace among ourselves . This is an appeal declared in the Qur'an. Allah says in the Holy Quran :-
"O mankind! we created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and Tribes, that ye may know Each other (Not that ye may despise (each other). Verily the Most honoured of you In the sight of Allah is (He who is) the Most righteous of you. and Allah has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things)" (49/13)
-- This declaration is for all mankind all over the world. The most honoured people in the sight of Allah not the most beautiful or the most interesting or the most wealthy or the strongest no but the most righteous ,pure pious and devout.Allah does not look at our images or shapes but He (pbth) look at our hearts.The righteous people always have pure hearts.They always fear Allah and love all his creatures.
2- Allah (pbth) taught us how to treat with each other and how to spread peace and love with each other . Allah says in the Holy Quran :- " O ye who believe! let not some men among you laugh at others: it may be that the (latter) are better than the (former): nor let some women laugh at others: it may be that the (latter are better than the (former): nor defame nor be sarcastic to Each other, nor call Each other by (offensive) nicknames: . seeming is a name connoting wickedness, (to be used of one) after He has believed: and those who do not desist are (indeed) doing wrong. 12. O ye who believe! avoid suspicion As much (as possible): for suspicion In some cases is a sin: and spy not on Each other behind their backs. would any of you like to eat the flesh of His dead brother? Nay, ye would abhor it...But fear Allah. for Allah is Oft-Returning, Most Merciful.(49/11-12)
--- These are some principles that Allah (pbth) taught us .If I do well that is by the grace of Allah and his support.And if I do bad that is by my ignorance and the support of the accursed Satan. Oh my God. Shield us from the evils of ourselves and our bad deeds.
3- As you see Jesus (peace be upon him) as God or a son of God. Please ,Trust me this is a serious saying. Excuse me this is the eye of blasphemy and infidelity .This saying is the biggest insult to the Almighty God .It will never make Jesus (pbuh) happy,on the contrary it makes him very sad and very afraid to the state of his followers that overestimated and exaggerated in his love that they make him God. All evidences in the Bible deny the divinty of Jesus.Please refer to my article under the title " God is one in the Torah,in the Bible and in the Quran.Also track all the sayings of Jesus himself that ends with the phrase " who sent me " .In these sayings he confirmed that he is a messenger of Allah .Allah sent him to guide people to know and worship the only true God of that universe.Please tell me one only verse in the Bible that Jesus said "I am God worship me"
4- I will tell you the opinion of The Holy Quran (the last revelation in that world ) about the phrase "son of God" (and of course you are free to believe or not believe .To read them or not.To say I am not intrested or not)
68. They say: "(Allah) hath begotten a son!" - glory be to Him! He is self-sufficient! His are all things In the heavens and on earth! no warrant have ye for this! say ye about Allah what ye know not?
69. Say: "Those who invent a lie against Allah will never prosper."
70. A Little enjoyment In This world!- and then, to us will be their return, then shall we make them taste the severest penalty for their blasphemies.(10/68-70)

88. They say: "((Allah)) Most gracious has begotten a son!"
89. Indeed ye have put forth a thing Most monstrous!
90. At it the skies are ready to burst, the earth to split asunder, and the mountains to fall down In utter ruin,
91. That They should invoke a son for ((Allah)) Most Gracious.
92. For it is not consonant with the majesty of ((Allah)) Most gracious that He should beget a son.
93. Not one of the beings In the heavens and the earth but must come to ((Allah)) Most gracious As a servant.
94. He does take an account of them (all), and hath numbered them (all) exactly.
95. And everyone of them will come to Him singly on the Day of Judgment. (19/88-95)
26. And They say: "((Allah)) Most gracious has begotten offspring." glory to Him! They are (but) servants raised to honour.
27. They speak not before He speaks, and They act (in all things) by His command.
28. He knows what is before them, and what is behind them, and They offer no intercession except for those who are acceptable, and They stand In awe and reverence of His (Glory).
29. If any of them should say, "I am a god besides Him", such a one we should reward with Hell: Thus do we reward those who do wrong. (21/26-29)

to be continued

Dear friend, you have given so much information here I'm not sure what it is you wish me to address. Or indeed if you are even interested in my point of view as to why a Christian believes as we do, it seems like muslims feel Christians have arrived by chance at an understanding of Gods message and we sort of make it up as we will.... This is not so. God placed us where God wants us to be, God gave us His truth through His Word.. Christ Jesus. We need to be clear about that. It appears to me that it is your intention to attempt to prove this Word God gave us is false, or even more incredible has been changed. On the first point I question... Why would God give us His Word which was not true to His divine being? On the second point I would ask... Why would God allow low men to change His Word? Either scenario I have difficulty ascribing to a Holy God, and my view is God is indeed Holy above all.

On your point of Gods declaration in regards to mankind... We can concur agreement here. As the Bible says the exact same thing. Christians may take it further in believing that the physical body is not as important to God than our soul, after all our body is purely a vehicle for our soul until such time as it returns to God. This body is a great gift, so of course we should be duty bound to keep ourselves fit and healthy so we are able to serve God in the best way. Maybe that is why we have less regulation in such matters as dress etc. for we do not see what clothes we wear have any baring on the state of our soul.

In regards to Jesus and His divinity, your answers are of course from your own Islamic perspective... Only natural.. And obviously.. Again only natural.. I do not see how they apply. As it seems clear from your quotes from the Quran, Christians have never viewed the son ship of Jesus in the way the Quran describes, which in itself is odd... If God was referring to Christians, then God as omniscient would know the hearts truth of what we believe.

Christians believe as the Bible and Jesus Himself through His words and actions taught.. Jesus Christ is the Son of God become human. By Son.. We do NOT mean biological son as we apply to human relationships and all that entails. Such belief is blasphemy of the worst kind. Jesus is truly a human being, our brother. He was born to a human mother, grew up and matured, learnt a trade, suffered hunger and thirst, displayed joy and compassion, anxiety and anger. He was a human being with body and soul – truly one of us, close to us. We see Jesus as same in essence as God the father... Jesus taught that His relationship was different with God the father as our relationship was with God. By Gods action through His Word Jesus, we the whole of humanity is healed by His love for us.

The Incarnation and the divinity of Jesus are a central theme in the Christian faith. For Christians, the doctrine of the Incarnation does not mean the deification of a man. Rather, in the Incarnation the eternal Word of God takes on a human nature and so becomes a human being. The expression Son of God serves as a pointer to the divine origin of Jesus and to the fact that in Jesus God has made himself present to humanity in a unique way. It is not a biological statement, such as would make of God a parent in the ordinary human sense. The church has always maintained that God neither begets nor is begotten... This corresponds to Quran which also says the same... Although I'm not sure that the context of this verse in the Quran refers to Christians and their beliefs.. It could refer to Meccan polytheism, which did attribute biological procreation to God, and seeing as Mohammed's message was aimed at the Meccan's initially it seems reasonable to suppose it was meant at them.


It remains central for Christian faith that the Son of God is one of us, with all that that entails, sin excepted. Jesus is therefore both divine and human in one person. You as a Muslim will never be able to accept this and I see even this must be difficult for you to read, yet, sometimes one has to face difficult things and even though you are unable totally to accept this, you should at least be able to see that to a Christian it makes perfect sense.. Because Gods Spirit assures us so. In truth Jesus is both fully human and fully divine, that is fully human, with a human soul and a human will, so that through his obedient humanity he could redeem our humanity, and yet also fully God, of one substance with the Father. Divinity and humanity are united in essence and purpose. This in no way detracts from the greatness of God, or the Oneness of God. The Bible and Jesus are also clear on the Oneness of God the Father, and indeed there is nothing comparable to Him.

In regards to Weather Jesus making or not making the claim "I am God worship me" is largely irrelevant. No where in the Bible does Jesus say these exact words, yet no where in the Bible does Jesus say he is not God and do not worship me. Sometimes words are not as strong as actions, there are many instances where Jesus accepted worship, and acted with authority in matters where it was accepted that such authority belonged to God alone.

My main issue with the Quran is to some extent it's misrepresentation of the beliefs of both Christians and to similar extent the Jews. These beliefs were then as they are now and long set in canons hundreds of years before the Quran was revealed. How the Quran represents the opinions of Christian belief at worse is in error at best it could only apply to a few gnostic sects found in that part of the world at that time. I cannot understand this. If the Quran was meant to be a final "instalment" or an "update" of what went before then I would expect it to have a more definitive idea of what it is replacing. I apologise if my words seem harsh and I really do not wish to cause offence but I am trying to answer your questions whilst also trying to let you see my doubts about Islam. I feel I have to be honest here, and to be honest sometimes one has to be blunt.

Peace and blessings to you.

[عثمان أحمد الشيخ]

Dear Pandora,
Thank you for your message . I will start where you have ended. You said:" I apologise if my words seem harsh and I really do not wish to cause offence but I am trying to answer your questions whilst also trying to let you see my doubts about Islam." .Please, No apology. We have agreed to speak frankly and clearly and without any sensitivity or any critical
1- You said : " My main issue with the Quran is to some extent it's misrepresentation of the beliefs of both Christians and to similar extent the Jews. These beliefs were then as they are now and long set in canons hundreds of years before the Quran was revealed" and you think that "If the Quran was meant to be a final "instalment" or an "update" of what went before then I would expect it to have a more definitive idea of what it is replacing."
--- The matter is not as you think. Allah (pbth) desended The Torah and The Bible to guide people to the true faith and worship the only true God who created me and you all that world . But the followers of Moses and Jesus (peace be upon both of them) did not keep these revelations well . As a result there is no original revelation of these Holy Books now and some humans (excuse me ) messed with these books, they added to and deleted from them according to their fancy ( there is an evidence from the Quran ).So The Almighty Allah descended the Holy Quran and pledged to save it till the day of resurrection.Allah said in the Quran :- " We have, without doubt, sent down the Message; and we will Assuredly guard it (from corruption).(15/9). So there is only one book all over the world. Muslims all over the world are uttering the Quran as it was descended on the messenger of Allah. The Holy Quran came down to correct the errors that have occurred due to human deeds.
---- For an example only to what I wrote :
** In the Old Testament Exo 20/11 For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it". This is the wrong image of Allah the creator of that universe.Allah says : "There is nothing whatever like unto him, and He is the one that hears and sees (All things)".(42/11) and there is a verse like that completely in the Bible. Allah never feel tired that He (pbth) take a rest . That is an insult to The Almighty Allah .So Allah said in the Holy Quran :- "38. We created the heavens and the earth and all between them In six days, nor did any sense of weariness touch us.(50/38) .I ask you which of the two verses befitting the dignity and the sanctity and greatness of the Almighty God ? Also the image of most prophets is very bad .Does Allah chose fornicator prophets in order to call people to virtue .The image of David (peace be upon him) in the Torah is a shameful image but in the Quran David is a pure ,rightouse and obedient prophet.All prophets and messengers of Allah are the stars of that universe.They are models for us to be followed (peace be upon them all )
** In the Bible John 1(5/7-8) For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one. 8 And there are three that bear witness in earth, the Spirit, and the water, and the blood: and these three agree in one.
-- Priests used to use these verses to prove "trinity". Now the phrase " three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost:' was deleted from all translated versions all over the world and it is found only in all Arabic versions and in King James version. Peace and blessing to you and to all our brothers and sisters all over that vast world and may Allah (God) guide us all to the right way.Ameen,Ameen.


To be continued