اقتباس:
المشاركة الأصلية كتبت بواسطة huria
Well Islam does not make sense to you because you do not want it to make sense but let me put this in prospective, as a lot of Christians do not bother searching for Islam from its source, they just use the same hate propaganda that been used against Islam in years. For me if Muslims claim something against Christianity, I will hear from both sides, and I don’t just carry what I have been told, there are cases Christians will answer some aspects credibly, and it make sense to me (not the whole religion) but some aspects, they have valid answers for. Christians I discuss with however, they try to twist the truth, and as I said the same old lies against Islam, like we are in debate war, it is not who win the debate that matters, it is who will have the last laugh in the life after.
My source is the Quran and talking to muslims like yourself. With all due respect it does not seem you take your information of the Bible from the Bible itself by reading it in the context it was meant.. If you did I fear you would not say the things you do half the time. However, just as I am not a Muslim and so the Quran does not make sense to me then I expect the same goes for you in regards to the Bible.. It comes down to context and understanding the nature of the work. Muslims tend to judge the Bible by the same standards they set for the Quran, it is not possible to do this in any meaningful way. For a start the Quran is just one little book, the Bible is not.. But a collection of books. As for having the last laugh... Well that a really sad outlook to have in regards to the important matter of ones future eternal salvation. I do so hope the last laugh is not on yourself. If you permit I would like to make some observations about the account you have given in regards to Adam and Eve, and why it does not make as much sense as the Biblical version, which btw you have not given a very accurate account of.
اقتباس:
Now let’s write the simple story of Islam, God created Angels, and Jin, and then Human. He created Adam peace be upon him, the father of humanity with desires, and free will, we have freedom of will, responsibility for our choice of action and the consequent accountability before God, the same goes for Jin except Satan or Iblis.
I agree that we are all created as Adam was with free will. This is because worship is worthless unless it is freely given..otherwise God could have created us as automatons if all He wished was for mankind to worship Him. I agree.. And Christianity also teaches that we are all responsible for our own actions and are held accountable for the same. I don't know what jinn are or why God saw the need to create them. Also I do not agree with satan/iblis being somehow exempt for accountability. The bible teaches satan was very much held accountable and was eternally punished and cursed for his part in the fall of man.
اقتباس:
Angeles in Islam do not sin, they have no free will, they do what they are told from God, and unlike Christianity we don’t believe that Satan was an angel, he was great servant of God but he disobeyed God, and the difference between his disobedience and of Adam, that Adam repented while Iblis refuse to repent, and his only ask from God was just delay my punishment until judgement day, and I will bring to hell as much as I could from the son of Adam.
((Iblis) said: “See this one whom You have honored above me, if You give me respite until the Day of Resurrection, I will surely seize and mislead his offspring all but a few!”) (Quran 17:62).
(Verily, My servants — you have no authority over them. And All-Sufficient is your Lord as a Guardian.) (Quran 17:65).
when was satan created as a "great servant of God"... For what purpose? Why would God give leave to satan to willingly allow the latter to lead Gods creation... mankind to perdition? We believe that angels are indeed created with free will, as they worship God and do His will the same requirement being that worship has to be freely given born of love not from obligation.. Otherwise worship is meaningless. Satan was created an angel and because of his free will and vanity wished to become like the creator and not be of the created. That is the reason satan was banished along with the host that chose to follow.. As free will allows. It is there aim to beleaguer mankind and to tempt them away from Gods path. By choosing satan over God mankind chooses eternal death over eternal life..
اقتباس:
God created us, and then thought our father how to repent, and who is his enemy. Adam peace be upon him was a messenger to his children, and he was the first messenger on Earth, the message is the same worship one God, and do not associate any partners with him and follow the messenger.
we do not see Adam as a messenger as the father of mankind there was none to tell except animals and his immediate family. He was a lesson to mankind... To serve as a reminder of Gods power and the consequences of disobedience towards God. An example of how sin prevents our communion with a Holy God. His message was not to worship the one god... If it were he failed miserably as most of mankind adopted pagan ways and worshipped idols. His message was to trust in the One God, because only through the one true God is mankind saved. Partners were immaterial as Adam had already "known" the nature of God, His Word and Spirit... And the message was always more important than the messenger. Messengers cMe and went for they are naught but mortal.. The word is eternal.
اقتباس:
Every messenger came with miracles, and books but Satan will send people astray from the truth then God will send, another messenger. People go astray, even to this day, you see so many sects, and divisions in one religion, they cannot be all the truth.
If God only sent one messenger and one book then people will complain why he did not send more, but God has sent many messengers, and every time the book get changed, corrupted etc so God sealed the religion with one more messengers, as prophet Muhammad peace be upon him as last messenger, and he did not come with new message it was the same “The Lord our God, the Lord is one” the only difference this time, since people like to see themselves, there were no more messengers, so how about miracles ? it had to stay, so God promised to preserve the last book from corruption, and that by itself is a miracle. Although it is miracles in many other aspects but that warrant another thread.
not every messenger came with miracles and not all miracles were from God. That is why we are told to test the prophets before we accept the message they bring is valid. We are told that many false prophets will come and lead people astray. From a biblical perspective the fact that so many prophets were chosen was simply the fact of human lifespan did not allow for Gods plan to be given in one fell swoop.. It was meant for different peoples from different times with the common theme that apart from worshipping and obeying the one God we also need God for our salvation and if we deviate from the path He places us on we do so at our peril.
اقتباس:
This is the story of Islam in short so what does not make sense??, as I explained God did not leave people without a message, and also prophet Muhammad peace be upon him did not come with new messages, it was the same of all prophets, Adam, Ibrahim, Jesus, Moses, and every messenger peace be upon them all.
prophet Mohammed did not bring the same message as the biblical prophets. You just tell yourself that the message was just to worship the one God, as Jews and Christians were worshipping the one true God ... YHWH.. Then I fail to see what was the point of the prophet Mohammed's revelation or what it brought new to the redemption of mankind that mankind had not already been given. Personally, I believe prophet Mohammed was sent to the pagans of Arabia to bring them to the one true God.
اقتباس:
Human are created with desires, and free will, animals only have desires. Islam teaches that what is halal (permissible), you can enjoy, and what is not allowed you avoid, as human are created with desires, God did not deprive us but he sets limits for us for example, marriage is permissible in Islam but fornication is not. That why we Muslims, find that priests and nuns who decide to not get married ever very strange, we see them as human who are been deprived of natural feelings, so when we read of news of priests scandals with kids, it does not surprise us at all, because when you deprive human of natural feelings, they become animals. Humans are not sinless but messengers are protected from major sins (kabaa’ir) but not from minor sins (saghaa’ir) is the view of the majority of the scholars of Islam.
we don't see that messengers are protected in any way from sin.. And sin is sin before God, weather big or small. We cannot judge how a Holy God views sin. Although if you say it's the view of a majority of scholars.. Then they have just arrived at that conclusion and are in danger of ascribing something to God that is not of God.
اقتباس:
We human sin because we were created that way , AND not because Adam and eve brought it for us or because we inherited.
Now let’s hear the story of Christianity, God created Adam and Eve, and he forbid them from eating from one tree and when they do eat from the tree God does not forgive them, and he sent messenger after messenger and these messengers none of them mention that the son of God will be crucified. In fact after thousands of years, the son of God appear, he does not even say to them I am going to be crucified, so God the father send his son while his son is him, and holy spirit is him too but never in order of Holy spirit, son, then Father even though they are equal!! So any way in order to go back to paradise and redeem ourselves from the sin our father and mother committed we have to accept that the son of God was spat on killed, and humiliated, and accepting this humiliation upon the son of God you gain your salivation., makes perfect sense!
Demands on my time means I will have to address the rest of your post later, 