Does it give you a criteria by which to judge the true from the false?
Ok then.. No problemo.
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We seem to differ a lot here . If th word "faith" means believe without evidence , I'll just use "belief" . We have different reasons to believe that Islam is true . And they're all logical . They don't have to be logical in the sense of "Scientifical and material" but logical to the mind . We see evidence in that the prophet peace upon him can't be a liar - his people always called him the honest and truthful - , we see evidence in that he invites to a true religion exalting the creator from any form of negative charecteristics allegated to him by other ones . We see evidence in the numeral miracles on multiple scales in Quran and Sunnah . But most importantly , we see proof in how it speaks to the pure nature of the heart .
with all due respect, majority opinion is not a measure of logic. Scientific and numerical miracles are found in all areas of life, and certainly in relation to mathematical sequences they can be found in all books within word patterns. They are not miraculous in themselves. Otherwise if we were to find the same numerical sequences in say.. The works of Shakespeare then are we to take it his works are if divine origin? Don't think so. I do so agree with your last comment.. How it speaks to the pure nature of the heart.. That can be used as a measure of divinity. I get exactly that from the Bible and Christianity.
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Pandora , you can't possibly mean what you said about logic and faith being different because logic can change and faith is unshakeable . If so , we might someday see this equations of Atheism true (0+0=1) and tha's complete absurdity ! There are things called self evident truths "Badeehyyat" which can never be changed . Scientific and physical laws and theories aren't ones of them and maybe that's what you meant . On the other hand , if faith is unshakable and we should take that as proof , everyone can claim he's on the right path even those who worship cows . And no , it's not unshable . Otherwise , no one of any religion would leave it for another which clearly isn't the case .
maybe I did not explain well.. I meant by relying on logical proofs that conform to our understanding of science, logic etc. in current time. Then if and when someone in the future comes along and proves that wrong then your basis for belief could crumble. If you have pure faith, that God is all powerful nothing can assail that because you cannot prove it by means of human understanding. For the simple reason God will always be beyond our understanding except for that which God chooses to reveal to us. It's for God to determine who is on the right path.. We can claim what we like the ultimate knowledge is Gods and Gods alone. For me this moment in time God has chosen for me Christianity and given me my faith in Jesus as my redeemer the the guidance of the Spirit. For you you have been sent on a different path... That we choose to question and explore that "path" on our journey is good for then we can be sure we have not been... As the saying goes.... Slipped a custard. ;)
I see .
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To clear things , I seem to have been unclear . In Arabic , the word "Maal" means whatever a person owns . I thought it can be translated to "financially" . Thus , if the word means "Cash" , I went in the wrong direction .
Fair enough.. I just hope you got my point that such things are of no importance to God, what we do with them if we have them may be... But the possession of them ..not at all.
[/QUOTE]I take it back , there's a huge gap between you and Pandora . I'm talking with two individuals on completely different levels ! And even though you contradict yourself and book with your continuous baseless attacks on Islam , you just keep doing it . Not to mention that you have this annoying habit of spamming slanders one after another which are completely unrelated to the subject . So I'm not wrong when I say you'r clearly insecure .
First of all pal , a miracle doesn't have to be explained with science . And to clear things up , you need to know that "Science" isn't "Knowledge" , it's a mere fragment of it . Science deals only on the material level . So when you want me to explain the existence of angels materially , you're asking for something absurd . Secondly , the miracle of the moon splitting was mainly for the pagans at Makkah who asked for a miracle . Some believed and the stubborn didn't . So it wouldn't be surprising if other people didn't see it . Still , they DID see it . No , I won't show you the crack on the moon by NASA as it's debatable but actual cultures recording the incident . This is in India :
[IMG]http://www.iosworld.org/interview_cheramul.htm[/url]
And there's a mention about manscriptues of Madrid , I lost the page really , but this is the quote :
Wanna see the Persian manuscriot ? Here :
[url]http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cb/Mohammed_Splits_the_Moon.jpg/300px-Mohammed_Splits_the_Moon.jpg[/IMG]
Oh . and a Muslim asked a library of the Indian manuscript and got this message in return :
So when you ask "Why didn't floods happen" and all , you're contradicting the meaning of a miracle ! And don't get me started because based on this flawed thinking I can say the same about any miracle in the Bible .
Thirdly , trying to force your slander further by saying "God doesn't do things to show off" is a cheap attempt and it can be used the same way with any mentioned miracle in any religion .
And if you keep the STUPID widely spread farce of "Muslims worship the moon" , you're gonna get it . It's enough that Quran says :
And :
And there are numerous signs in Quran about subjecting the sun and moon . AND :
The crecent was the adopted by the Ottomans - ever saw the flag of Turkey ? -and it doesn't hold any religious meaning in Islam . I can take any crescent on a mosque and step on it - Not literally of course , that's vandelizing - so can you do the same with a cross ?
Or like that Jesus walked on water without evidence ? Don't say the Bible because I can claim it's corrupted just to fend you off although I have other reasons to believe it is .
So are you going to discuss like a normal person would or do you just want to embarass yourself more ? I don't have an issue , but if you want it , I can drop the fancy treatment and treat you the same way you treat others .
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