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Quote Originally Posted by MrsClaus92 View Post



You are still incorrect saying that most Christians believe in the trinity. Christians believe in God and believe Jesus is his son born of a mortal woman, Jesus refers to himself as the "Son of Man" in the New Testament. Christians believe he is the suffering Messiah and that he is one with God, in the same way that one man has both a body and a torso – one God is the holy spirit and Jesus. ?
This belief that you are describing which states that God and Jesus and the holy spirit are one n the same manner that a man has a body , a mind and a soul is the trinity
This is the faith of the catholics, the orthodox and the protestant which are the main bulk of christians in the world
Jehova's witnesses who don't believe that the Christ is God are a minority among christians

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There's actually a lot of evidence to support that belief- in Genesis 1, God is a spirit, hovering over the water (Gen 1:2), but the spirit of God can "wear" people, just like you can put on clothes… (Judges 6:34 for example) and God shows up in human form even in Genesis- Adam and Eve hear him WALKING in the garden- not hovering… Jacob is described wrestling with A MAN- that has thighs, head, body, feet, toes… yet he calls that place "The face of God" (Hebrew PneiEl) and explains: "for I have seen God face to face" and just think of it, God created man in his image… so what would God's image be??? Only Christians believe in 3 gods as in the sense of the holy trinity, and some Christians don't even believe Jesus is divine.



It's strange that you are trying to support christian faith from the old testament
Christians also believe that God abandoned the jews because they didn't blieve in prophet Jesus Pbuh, which is against your faith, and you are claiming that islam is false because God will nver abandon the jews, so you are just contradicting with yourself
Anyhow to quickly discuss the evidence you are using to prove the christian faith from the OT
:
-
Genesis 1:2 doesn't say that God is a spirit, it says according to some translations that God's spirit is hovering over water
:
2And the earth was without form and void, and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

However there are other translationsthat translate the passage as God's wind not God's sprit like the NRSV
:

In the beginning when God created[a] the heavens and the earth, 2 the earth was a formless void and darkness covered the face of the deep, while a wind from God[b] swept over the face of the
waters.


So it's just a possible translation and can't be solid evidence to prove christian faith

Moreover Jews understand the term (God's spirit) in a sense that is completely diffrent from that of christians
Jews understand that God's spirit means his spritual power while christians underatand that God's spirit is a person of 3 in Godhead, and although there are 3 persons in Godhead yet they are all one

I agree with you that according to jews God appeared as a man in certain situations but this has nothing to support christian faith
Anyhow, Islam is the only religion in which God never appeared as a man simply becausenothing can be similar to God, this is one of the things which make me sure that islam is the truth

I really don't understand how can you believe that Jacob Pbuh wresteled with God
?
Do you really believe in this
?
What's the difference between this and the grek tales about their gods
?
Moreover Jacob Pbuh was about to win his battle against God according to the Tanach
:
24 And Jacob was left alone, and there wrestled a man with him until the breaking of the day.
25 And when the man saw that he prevailed not against him, he touched the hollow of his thigh; and the hollow of Jacob’s thigh was out of joint as he wrestled with him.
26 And the man said, “Let me go, for the day breaketh.” And he said, “I will not let thee go, unless thou bless me.”
27 And he said unto him, “What is thy name?” And he said, “Jacob.”
28 And he said, “Thy name shall be called no more Jacob, but Israel; for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed.”
29 And Jacob asked him, and said, “Tell me, I pray thee, thy name.” And he said, “Why is it that thou dost ask after my name?” And he blessed him there.
30 And Jacob called the name of the place Peniel [that is, The face of God]: “For I have seen God face to face, and my life is preserved
.”

How on earth can ayone believe that God isasking Jacob to let him go after he was not able to prevail during wrestling
?

This story makes me 100% sure that the Tanach was to a certain extent fabricated


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So… Jehovah's witness believe and preach the faith in one God only, but Islam is not the international version of Jehovah's witness because Jehovah's witness say something that isn't in line with Islam- i.e. that Jesus is God's son. So how is Islam in line with Zoroastrianism or any other monotheistic religion if they say things that are not in line with Islam, for example, that Satan created the Genies, rather than that Allah created them from fire?



As I told you ,we believe that the messages of the previous prophets were to a certain extent fabricated
The Ebonites were early christians who believed that God is one and prophet Jesus Pbuh was a normal man, not God or the son of God, we believe that the Ebonites are the true fellowers of prophet Jesus Pbuh not the Catholics or the Orthodox or the Protestant or Jehova's witnesses, thy are all not following the true teachings of Jesus Pbuh

Read this
:
http://hardquestions.wordpress.com/tag/ebonites/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ebionites



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According to Quran, Abraham did not place Isaac on the alter but rather, it was Ishmael (since Isaac wasn't born yet)- it is not in line with Judaism, so how is it an international version of Judaism?



Yes we believe that the son who was about to be sacrificed was Ishmael pbuh not Isaac Pbuh and we believe that this is one of the fabrications in the tanach and it's so simple to prove

Let's read from Genesi 22
:
22:1 Some time after these things God tested1Abraham. He said to him, “Abraham!” “Here I am!” Abraham2replied. 22:2 God3said, “Take your son – your onlyson, whom you love, Isaac4– and go to the land of Moriah!5Offer him up there as a burnt offering6on one of the mountains which I will
indicate to7you.”

As clear, Isaac Pbuh was never the onl son of Abraham Pbuh becaue he was the younger child so this must be a fabrication

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In Judaism, God promises to punish the wicked of his people, but never to utterly abandon them, never to stop being their God, even if they break their covenant with him- he will remember his everlasting covenant with them- how is that in line with Islam claiming God deserted the Jews for their iniquities???





Where in the Tanach did God promise never to abandon the jews
?
Why on earth couldn't God send a prophet except from among the Jews
?
If God hasn't abandoned the jews, why aren't there anymore prophets from among the jews for about 2500 years although there were a lot of prophets among the jews in the past
?
If God didn't abandon the Jews why did Prophet Jesus Pbuh tell the jews in the NT that God will abandon them
?
If God didn't abandon the jews why did a an come from among the arabs and say that he is the messenger of the same God of the same God of the jews but he was sent not only to the jews but to all mankind and now there are 1.6 bilio people who beieve in him as th messenger of God why there are only 12 million jews
?
Do you think that God is not kind enough to send prophets to people other than the jews
?
Do you think tha God will leave all nations without messengers apar from Jews
?
Do you think that God is a racist
?
Mrs Claus, I feel that you are just finding for yourself excuses in order not to believe in prohet Muhammad Pbuh