help me in defending our prophet on ICQ

بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم
السلام عليكم ورحمة الله وبركاته
كتبت موضوع من فترة عن نبوة الرسول:salla-y: في الكتاب المقدس ووضعته علي احدي منتديات ICQ
وجاءني رد منهم
ولكنني اريد ان ارد عليه ولكن اللغة لا تسعفني بالقدر الذي يرضيني
فياريت حد فيكم يقدر يساعدني سواء بارسال الرد المناسب هنا علي هذا المنتدي او يرد عليه في المنتدي اللي ع ال ICQ
عموما هذا هو رابط الموضوع:
http://www.icq.com/groups/index.php?...0&forum_page=1
اتمني ان اجد الرد منكم في اسرع وقت ممكن لانني اتاخرت في الرد عليهم نظرا لظروف الامتحانات
جزاكم الله كل خير

بواسطة قسيس سابق موقع غني جدا بالمادة العلمية ياريت تذكري بتفصيل اكثر نوع الموضوع المطروح ولو على الخاص
www.islamtomorrow.com

هذا هو الموضوع اللي كنت كتبته وبعده ان شاء الله هكتب لكم رد الرجل المسيحي اللي انا عاوزة رد عليه:





prophecy of Muhammad in Bible
In the Bible,,there are many verses telling about the prophecy of Muhammad,, let`s say some in short: book of Deuteronomy 18:18

18

I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.



THE first point :here God told that he will send prophet from the brothers of Israiliens ( he didn`t tell from them but tell from their brothers) so if any one explain this as prophecy for Jesus, it`s not true ,,why?

coz jesus was from israilians,,,, BUT this prophecy was for Muhammad coz he`s from the sons of Ismaiel ( who is brother of Israiel , so son`s of israiel are considered brothers for sons of Ismaiel).....


so if he meant jesus he would said "among them" not "among their brothers"


THE2nd point: here God talk to MOse he said "like you" so the meant prophet is like Mose ...so come to compare between Mose,Jesus and Muhammad to see who of them is "like Mose":


MOSE JESUS MUHAMMAD


Birth: normal labour abnormal normal labour

from mother with no father from mother

and father and father


life married didn`t marry marry



leadership was a leader wasn`t was leader of

for israiliens muslims and build

a nation


Death died normally was cruisfied died normally

(in christian

belief)

was lift by

GOD (in islamic

belief)



so that who of them is like Mose ???????


answer is Muhammad



there`s also very clear verse in the Bible talking about Muhammad:

2

And he said, The LORD came from Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, and he came with ten thousands of saints: from his right hand went a fiery law for them.


The book of Deuteronomy 33:2


Here God said:

" LORD came from Sinai" : this means the prophecy of MOSE

who recieve God words in Sinai ( place in East of Egypt)


"rose up from Seir "(place in Palastine) : so this is the prophecy of JESUS who was in palastine


"he shined forth from mount Paran", : This the prophecy of MUHAMMAD why?


Paran according to Strong`s Hebrew Bible Dictionary : means ( a desert of Arabia)

so who was the prophet in Paran????

He was Muhammad only


some claimed that jesus is the meant prophet here ,, but it`s not true ,, coz Jesus wasnt from Paran

BUT the only prophet from desert of Paran was Muhammad (ppuh)




my dear friends ,, i`ve more evidences on the prophecy of Muhammad in Bible......

if u`re intersted ,,i`ll supply u by it







In the Bible,,there are many verses telling about the prophecy of Muhammad,, let`s say some in short: book of Deuteronomy 18:18

18

I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him.



THE first point :here God told that he will send prophet from the brothers of Israiliens ( he didn`t tell from them but tell from their brothers) so if any one explain this as prophecy for Jesus, it`s not true ,,why?

coz jesus was from israilians,,,, BUT this prophecy was for Muhammad coz he`s from the sons of Ismaiel ( who is brother of Israiel , so son`s of israiel are considered brothers for sons of Ismaiel).....


so if he meant jesus he would said "among them" not "among their brothers"


THE2nd point: here God talk to MOse he said "like you" so the meant prophet is like Mose ...so come to compare between Mose,Jesus and Muhammad to see who of them is "like Mose":


MOSE JESUS MUHAMMAD


Birth: normal labour abnormal normal labour

from mother with no father from mother

and father and father


life married didn`t marry marry



leadership was a leader wasn`t was leader of

for israiliens muslims and build

a nation


Death died normally was cruisfied died normally

(in christian

belief)

was lift by

GOD (in islamic

belief)



so that who of them is like Mose ???????


answer is Muhammad



there`s also very clear verse in the Bible talking about Muhammad:

2

And he said, The LORD came from Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, and he came with ten thousands of saints: from his right hand went a fiery law for them.


The book of Deuteronomy 33:2


Here God said:

" LORD came from Sinai" : this means the prophecy of MOSE

who recieve God words in Sinai ( place in East of Egypt)


"rose up from Seir "(place in Palastine) : so this is the prophecy of JESUS who was in palastine


"he shined forth from mount Paran", : This the prophecy of MUHAMMAD why?


Paran according to Strong`s Hebrew Bible Dictionary : means ( a desert of Arabia)

so who was the prophet in Paran????

He was Muhammad only


some claimed that jesus is the meant prophet here ,, but it`s not true ,, coz Jesus wasnt from Paran

BUT the only prophet from desert of Paran was Muhammad (ppuh)




my dear friends ,, i`ve more evidences on the prophecy of Muhammad in Bible......

if u`re intersted ,,i`ll supply u by it

متابع

اعتذر للتأخير
شكرا لك اخي عبد الرحمن لمتابعتك
واليكم رد هذا الرجل المسيحي علي مقالي:


About the prophecies of Mohammed


Let us go over each of the passages in the Bible that would seem to reference Mohammed.

Deuteronomy 18:15-18

15 The LORD your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among your own brothers. You must listen to him.

16 For this is what you asked of the LORD your God at Horeb on the day of the assembly when you said, "Let us not hear the voice of the LORD our God nor see this great fire anymore, or we will die."

17 The LORD said to me: "What they say is good.

18 I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their brothers; I will put my words in his mouth, and he will tell them everything I command him.

This is the promise God had made to Moses, and a passage the muslims believe as a prophecy fulfilled in Mohammed, of whom the Koran claims when it refers to "The unlettered Prophet," and also the muslims claim is also mentioned in their own [scriptures], in the Law and the Gospels (Surah 7:157).


This prophecy could not be a reference to Mohammed for several reasons.


1. The term "brethren" refers to Israel, not to their Arabian antagonists. Who would God raise up for Israel a prophet from their enemies?

2. In this very context, the term "brethren" means fellow Israelites. For the Levites were told:

Deuteronomy 18:2

They shall have no inheritance among their brothers; the LORD is their inheritance, as he promised them.

3. Elsewhere in this book the term "brethren also means fellow Israelites, not a foreigner. God told them to choose a king "from among your brethren," not a "foreigner." Israel has never chosen a non-Jewish king.

4. Mohammed came from Ishmael, as even Muslims admit, and heirs to the Jewish throne came from Isaac. When Abraham prayed:

Genesis 17:18

And Abraham said to God, "If only Ishmael might live under your blessing!"

God emphatically replied:

Genesis 17:20-21a

20 And as for Ishmael, I have heard you: I will surely bless him; I will make him fruitful and will greatly increase his numbers. He will be the father of twelve rulers, and I will make him into a great nation.
21 But my covenant I will establish with Isaac, whom Sarah will bear to you by this time next year." (emphasis added)

And later, God repeated His promise to Abraham:

Genesis 21:12

But God said to him, "Do not be so distressed about the boy and your maidservant. Listen to whatever Sarah tells you, because it is through Isaac that your offspring will be reckoned. (emphasis added)


5. The Koran itself states that the prophetic line came through Isaac, not Ishael:

Surah 29:27

And We bestowed on him Isaac and Jacob, and We established the Prophethood and the Scripture among his seed...

The Muslim scholar Yusuf Ali adds the word "Abraham" and changes the meaning as follows:

We gave (Abraham) Isaac and Jacob, and ordained Among his progeny Prophethood and Revelation.

By adding Abraham, the father of Ishmael, he can includ Mohammed, a descendent of Ishmael, in the prophetic line! But Abraham's name is not found in the original Arabic text.

6. Jesus perfectly fulfilled this verse, since

a. He was from among His jewish brethren:

Galatians 4:4

But when the time had fully come, God sent his Son,

born of a woman, born under law,

b. He fulfilled Deuteronomy 18:18 perfectly:

Deuteronomy 18:18

I will put my words in his mouth, and he will tell them

everything I command him.

Jesus Himself said:

John 8:28

So Jesus said, "When you have lifted up the Son of Man,

then you will know that I am the one I claim to be and

that I do nothing on my own but speak just what the

Father has taught me.

And:

John 12:49

For I did not speak of my own accord, but the Father

who sent me commanded me what to say and how to

say it.

c. He called Himself a "prophet":

Luke 13:33

In any case, I must keep going today and tomorrow and

the next day—for surely no prophet can die outside

Jerusalem!

The people considered him a prophet:

Matthew 21:11

The crowds answered, "This is Jesus, the prophet from

Nazareth in Galilee."

Luke 7:16

They were all filled with awe and praised God. "A great

prophet has appeared among us," they said. "God has

come to help his people."

John 4:19

"Sir," the woman said, "I can see that you are a

prophet.

John 6:14

After the people saw the miraculous sign that Jesus did,

they began to say, "Surely this is the Prophet who is to

come into the world."

John 7:40

On hearing his words, some of the people said, "Surely

this man is the Prophet."

John 9:17

Finally they turned again to the blind man, "What have

you to say about him? It was your eyes he opened."
The man replied, "He is a prophet."

As the Son of God, Jesus was:

• Prophet (speaking to men for God)

• Priest (speaking to God from men): Hebrews 7-10

(click for online Bible chapters)

• and King (reigning over men for God): Revelation 19-20

(click for online Bible chapters)

7. Finally, there are other characteristics of the "Prophet" to come that fit only Jesus, not Mohammed, such as, He spoke with God "face to face" and He performed "signs and wonders."


_____________________________________________


Deuteronomy 33:2

He said:
"The LORD came from Sinai
and dawned over them from Seir;
he shone forth from Mount Paran.
He came with myriads of holy ones
from the south, from his mountain slopes.


Islamic scholors today believe that this verse predicts the visitations of three people: Moses (on Sinai), another to "Seir" through Jesus, and a third in "Paran" (Arabia) through Mohammed who came to Mecca with an army of "ten thousand."


Let us break down this notion for a moment.

Firstly, this claim can be easily answered by looking at a Bible map. Paran and Seir are near Egypt in the Sinai peninsula, not in Palestine where Jesus m inistered. Nor was Paran near Mecca, but hundreds of miles away near southern Palestine in the north eastern Sinai.

Furthermore, this verse is speaking of the "LORD" (not Mohammed) coming. And He is coming with "ten thousands of saints," or "myriads of holy ones," not ten thousand soldiers, as Mohammed did.

Deuteronomy 33:2 (KJV)

And he said, The LORD came from Sinai, and rose up from Seir unto them; he shined forth from mount Paran, and he came with ten thousands of saints: from his right hand went a fiery law for them.

There is absolutely no basis in this text for the Muslim claim here.


Finally, this prophecy is said to be the one "with which Moses the man of God blessed the children of Israel before his death"

Deuteronomy 33:1

This is the blessing that Moses the man of God pronounced on the Israelites before his death.

If it were a prediction about Islam, which has been the constant enemy of Israel, it could scarcely have been a blessing to Israel. In fact, the chapter goes on to pronounce a blessing on each of the tribes of Israel by God, who "will thrust out the enemy".

Deuteronomy 33:27

The eternal God is your refuge,
and underneath are the everlasting arms.
He will drive out your enemy before you,
saying, 'Destroy him!'


_____________________________________________


Deuteronomy 34:10

Since then, no prophet has risen in Israel like Moses, whom the LORD knew face to face,

This is another verse that is used to argue that Jesus could not have been the predicted prophet, but was instead Mohammed.

Again, several things should be considered here.

1. The word "since" here means since Moses' death to the time this last chapter was written, most likely by Joshua. Even if Deuteronomy was written much later as some critics argue, it would still have been written many centuries before the time of Christ, and therefore, would not eliminate Him.

2. Jesus was the perfect fulfillment of this prediction of the prophet to come, not Mohammed (see comments above on Deut. 18).

3. This could not refer to Mohammed, since the prophet to come was like Moses:

Deuteronomy 34:11

who did all those miraculous signs and wonders the LORD sent him to do in Egypt—to Pharaoh and to all his officials and to his whole land.

Mohammed, by his own confession, did not perform signs and wonders like Moses and Jesus (Surah 17:90-93).

4. The prophet that is to come was like Moses who spoke "face to face" with God (see Deut. 34:10 above). Mohammed never even claimed to speak to God directly, but got his revelations through angels (Surah 2:97).

But Jesus, like Moses, was:

a. a direct mediator:

1 Timothy 2:5

For there is one God and one mediator between God and

men, the man Christ Jesus,

Hebrews 9:15

For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant,

that those who are called may receive the promised

eternal inheritance—now that he has died as a ransom

to set them free from the sins committed under the first

covenant.

b. who communicated directly with God:

John 1:18

No one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only, who

is at the Father's side, has made him known.

John 12:49

For I did not speak of my own accord, but the Father who

sent me commanded me what to say and how to say it.


_____________________________________________


Psalm 45:3-5

3 Gird your sword upon your side, O mighty one;
clothe yourself with splendor and majesty.

4 In your majesty ride forth victoriously
in behalf of truth, humility and righteousness;
let your right hand display awesome deeds.

5 Let your sharp arrows pierce the hearts of the king's enemies;
let the nations fall beneath your feet.

This is another verse that is viewed by Muslims as another prophecy of Mohammed.

Since this verse speaks of one coming with the "sword" to subdue his enemies, it is viewed as a prediction of Mohammed, who was known as "the prophet of the sword," and claim Jesus could not possibly have been foretold here, since He never came with a sword, and site verses like the following in support:

Matthew 26:52

"Put your sword back in its place," Jesus said to him (Peter), "for all who draw the sword will die by the sword.

But this contention fails for three reasons:

1. The very next verse in Psalms identifies the person spoken of as "God":

Psalm 45:6

Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever;
a scepter of justice will be the scepter of your kingdom.


whom Jesus claimed to be:

John 8:58

"I tell you the truth," Jesus answered, "before Abraham was born, I am!" John 10:30

I and the Father are one." But Mohammed denied he was God, saying he was only a human prophet.

2. The New Testament affirms that this passage refers to Christ:

Hebrews 1:8


But about the Son he says,
"Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever,
and righteousness will be the scepter of your kingdom. 3. Although Jesus did not come the first time with a sword, He will at His second coming:

Revelation 19:11-16

11I saw heaven standing open and there before me was a white horse, whose rider is called Faithful and True. With justice he judges and makes war. 12His eyes are like blazing fire, and on his head are many crowns. He has a name written on him that no one knows but he himself. 13He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God. 14The armies of heaven were following him, riding on white horses and dressed in fine linen, white and clean. 15Out of his mouth comes a sharp sword with which to strike down the nations. "He will rule them with an iron scepter." He treads the winepress of the fury of the wrath of God Almighty. 16On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written:
KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS.


_____________________________________________


Isaiah 21:7

When he sees chariots
with teams of horses,
riders on donkeys
or riders on camels,
let him be alert,
fully alert."

The claim here is that the rider of the donkeys is Jesus and the rider on camels to be Mohammed, which is believed to have superseded Jesus. However, this passage is actually speaking of the fall of Babylon:

Isaiah 21:9

Look, here comes a man in a chariot
with a team of horses.
And he gives back the answer:
'Babylon has fallen, has fallen!
All the images of its gods
lie shattered on the ground!' "

and the news of its fall that was spread by various means, mainly horses, donkeys and camels.


_____________________________________________


Habakkuk 3:3

God came from Teman,
the Holy One from Mount Paran.
Selah
His glory covered the heavens
and his praise filled the earth.

This verse is also used to point out the coming of Mohammed, and use it in connection with Deut. 33:2 (see above). Mentioned earlier above about Deuteronomy 33:2, Paran is nowhere near Mecca, but hundreds of miles away. The verse here is speaking of "God" coming. The "praise" couldn't refer to Mohammed because the subject of both "praise" and "glory" is God ("His"), and Mohammed is not God. *



* Subject matter compiled largely with the help of "When Critics Ask: A Popular Handbook on Bible Difficulties" by Norman L. Geisler/Thomas Howe, and can be purchased at Amazon.com.

بالنسبة لنبوءة التثنية
أرجو مراجعة الرابط
http://www.ebnmaryam.com/vb/showthread.php?t=26921
و فى انتظار ردك أختى الفاضلة

السلام عليكم ورحمة الله وبركاته
جزاك الله خيرا اخي عبد الرحمن
انا فعلا استفادت من هذا الرابط
ولكن يا ريت عاوزة حد يساعدني في الرد عليه بالانجليزية
لان اللغة لا تسعفني قوي في الرد عليه

جزانا و إياكم
و تحت أمرك فى كل ما تطلبينه

http://www.answering-christianity.co...s_rebuttal.htm

الرابط السابق توجد به مناظرة بالانجليزية عن نبوءة التثنية
و الطرف النصرانى يقول تقريبا نفس ما يقوله محاورك

جزاك الله كل الخير

جزانا و إياكم