...Bible Compared to Quran by Yusuf Estes & Dr. Gary Miller.....

Bible Compared to Quran


Based on transcripts of vairous lectures given by Yusuf Estes & Dr. Gary Miller

Introduction by Yusuf Estes -

I praise Almighty Allah and thank Him for guiding me to the light of Islam, and I testify there is none worthy of any worship, except Allah and that Muhammad is His messenger.
Let me begin by stating, we Muslims do not seek to put down or desecrete the Holy Bible, even though there is no extant piece of scripture in original form, we still hold in our hearts and minds a very high place for the original revelation of the Bible and for all of those to whom God inspired with its revelation.

It is a critical matter of faith for every Muslim to believe in the original revelations that came down to Moses, David, Solomon and Jesus, just as it is is important for Muslims to believe in the revelation of the Quran that came to Muhammad, peace be upon him. The key word here however, is "original." As we all know the origin of the Bible is clouded with centuries of copying, translating and passing down information, now long lost with only copies of manuscripts remaining to remind us of what once was the Bible.

Additionally, it should be noted that Muslims do not seek to destroy the Christians or Jews belief in the Word of God, rather it is an obligation for Muslims to call to what is right and to halt that which is evil. Certainly, causing the "People of the Book" (as the Quran refers to Christians and Jews) to fall into disbelief and leave off any faith in God at all, is the very opposite of the direction Muslims should take in presenting any comparison between Islam and what has come down in the past from the Almighty God. We only seek to bring about more light to the people seeking guidance and pray for all of us to be successful with our Lord in this life and in the Next life and we ask His Guidance and Support in doing so, ameen.

THE BIBLE

[Yusuf Estes]

Detailed Information on Bible on our websites:
www.BibleIslam.com * www.911Bible.com

Old Testament

There exists today a number of different versions in the ancient Hebrew language of the Jewish Book called the Torah [Law] and this is usually referred to in Christianity as The Old Testament. Naturally, there have been many different translations to a great number of languages over the centuries and one could not expect them to be identical in text or meaning. What we have in English today still remains somewhat similar to large amounts of these older documents.

New Testament

There are also different versions of the Gospel or what is commonly called The New Testament in the Koine Greek language and Latin and these also have many translations to even other langugaes. Even amongst the English translations there are great differences. To mention two very clear differences for example; the Catholic Bible [c. 325 A.D] contains 73 books in total, while the Protestant Bible contains only 66 books, and although the newer (Protestant version) was taken from the Catholic Bible even then these books do not match completely with each other. There is no common denominator for any of the many different versions of the Bible.

Dead Sea Scrolls

There have been a number of scrolls and parchments found in places surrounding what we call the "Holy Land" over the centuries, not the least of which are those often referred to as the "Dead Sea Scrolls" or as they are known to the scholars "Wadi Qumran Scrolls." These were discovered in the last century around 1930 and have been proven to be very ancient and could well be older than any other extant manuscripts. Much of what has been translated from these scrolls is similar to some of the oldest manuscripts, but there are still very important differences worthy of note. We would like to recommend some important reading on this topic at the end of this paper.

THE QURAN
[Yusuf Estes]

Detailed Information on Quran on our websites:
www.AllahsQuran.com * www.Qtafsir.com


Quran Means "Recitation"

The word "Quran" means "that which is recited; or that which is dictated in memory form." As such, it is not only a book, nor is it something that reaches us only in written form. The documentation in writting about the Quran has been preserved in museums thoughout the world, including the Topekopi Palace in Istanbul, Turkey, the museum in Tashkent, Uzbekistan and also in England. The Quran is still printed up to this day with the verification and supervision of councils of scholars who have the Quran down to memory and who make sure there are no printing mistakes.

Only One Version - Arabic

There are no different versions of the Quran in the Arabic language, only different translations and of course, none of these would be considered to hold the value and authenticity of the original Arabic Recitation. The Quran is divided up into 30 equal parts, called "Juz'" (parts) in the Arabic language. These are learned by Muslims from their very early beginnings as children.


Memorized by Millions - Entirely

The important thing to keep in mind about the Quran is the memorization and transmission of the actual "Rectiation" just as it came to Muhammad, peace be upon him, from the Angel Gabriel and was learned and memorized by his companions and they in turn, passed it down to their followers and continued in this way until we see today, over 10,000,000 (ten million) Muslims who have committed the entire Quran to memory. This is not a small feat. After all, how many other works of literary value have been memorized and passed down through so many generations, in the original language, without a single change in even one sentence?


Each Muslim Has "Quran" Memorized

All Muslims have memorzied a portion of the Quran in the Arabic language, as this is an important part of their daily prayers. Many Muslims have memorized large portions of the Quran from one tenth to one half to all of the entire Quran, and all in the original Arabic language. It should be noted, there are over one and a half billion (1,500,000,000) Muslims worldwide and only about 10% are Arab, all the rest are learing the Quran in Arabic as a second language.


God Speaks in First Person to Mankind in Quran

The Quran contains clear statements from Almighty God (Allah) and it is Him speaking to all of us in the first person. He tells of us our own creation, the creation of all that is the universe and what has happened to those before us and what is to become of us if we do not take heed of the warnings clearly spelled out in His Revelation. He speaks also to Muhammad, peace be upon him, to show that Muhammad, peace be upon him, is not making this up himself and even chastises Muhammad, peace be upon him, for making human assumptions rather than waiting for revelation in matters (ie.; surah At-Tahreem and surah Abasa).


Quran Mentions Itself

The Quran refers to itself as "The Quran" (The Recitation) and mentions that it is to all mankind and jinn (another creation of Allah, similar to humans in that they could make choices as to whether or not they would obey God's Commandments, and they existed before humans).


Quran Describes God's Nature Exactly

The Quran is clear on who God is and who He is not. There is no room left for doubt after reading the Quran in the Arabic languge: God is One. He is the only Creator, Sustainer and Owner of the Universe. He has no partners. He has no relatives; wives, children or offspring. He is not like His creation and He does not need it for His existance, while all the time the creation is totally dependent on Him. His attributes are clearly spelled out as the epitome of each and every one. He is for instance, the All-Knowing; the All-Hearing; the All-Seeing; the All-Forgiving; the All- Loving; the All-Merciful; the Only One God. There is never a contradiction to this found anywhere in the Quran.


Quran Challanges Readers

The Quran makes the clear challange, that if you are in doubt about it - then bring a book like it. Also, to bring ten chapters like it and then finally, to bring one single chapter like it. 1,400 years - and no one has been able to duplicate it's beauty, recitation, miracles and ease of memorization. Another challange for the unbelievers to consider; "If this (Quran) were from other than Allah, you would find within it many contradictions." And yet, another challange offered by Allah in the Quran is for the unbelievers to look around for evidences. Allah says He will show them His signs within themselves and on the farthest horizons.


Scientific Miracles in Quran

The scientific miracles of the Quran could not have been understood at that time, yet today we take for granted the many things included in the revelation of the Quran. Some include mentioning: The formation of embryo in the womb of the mother (surah 98); deep seas partitions; waters that do not mix; clouds and how they make rain and how lightning is caused by ice crystals; formation of the earth's mountains deep underground; orbits of planets and stars and moons - and even the mention of space travel (surah 55:33).
[Watch videos of world's top scientists commenting on the "Miracle of Science in Quran"]
http://islamyesterday.com/videos/science/

- COMPARISON of BIBLE & QURAN-

[Dr. Gary Miller- with Commentary by Yusuf Estes]

Bible is Collection of Writings -
Quran is Recitation From God to Muhammad (p)

Whereas, The Bible is a collection of writings by many different authors, the Quran is a dictation (or recitation). The speaker in the Quran - in the first person - is God Almighty (Allah) talking directly to man. In the Bible you have many men writing about God and you have in some places the word of God speaking to men and still in other places you have some men simply writing about history or personal exchanges of information to one another (ex: Epistle of John 3). The Bible in the English King James Version consists of 66 small books. About 18 of them begin by saying: This is the revelation God gave to so and so… The rest make no claim as to their origin. You have for example the beginning of the book of Jonah which begins by saying: The word of the Lord came to Jonah the son of Elmitaeh saying… quote and then it continues for two or three pages.

Compare this to the beginning of the Book of "Luke" begins by saying: “In as much as many have taken in hand to set in order a narrative of those things which have been fulfilled among us, (2) Just as those who from the beginning were eyewitnesses and ministers of the word delivered them to us, (3) It seemed good to me also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write to you an orderly account, most excellent Theophilus, (4) That you may know the certainty of those things in which you were instructed.

We see the author of the Book of "Luke" saying essentially, "Many people have written about things, it seems fitting for me to do so too.” "Luke" says it seems to him that as long as others are taking in hand to write something about it, even though they were eye witnesses to the whole thing, he feels that even though he was not, he still has "perfect understanding of all things from the very first."

Therefore this is only a letter from one person to another, neither of whom knew Jesus, peace be upon him, nor were eyewitnesses to any of what had taken place. [Y. Estes]

If you compare that to one of the four accounts of the life of Jesus, Luke begins by saying: “many people have written about this man, it seems fitting for me to do so too”. That is all… no claim of saying “ these words were given to me by God here they are for you it is a revelation”, there is no mention of this.

"Bible" is NOT in the Bible

The Bible does not contain self-reference, that is, the word 'Bible' is not in the Bible. Nowhere does the Bible talk about itself. Some scriptures are sometimes pointed to in the Bible, say: Here where it talks about itself, but we have to look closely. 2nd Timothy 3:16 is the favourite which reads: “All scripture is inspired of God” and there are those who would say, here is where the Bible it talks about itself, it says it is inspired of God, all of it. But if you read the whole sentence, you read that this was a letter wrote by Paul to Timothy and the entire sentence says to Timothy: “Since you were a young man you have studied the holy scriptures, all scriptures inspired by God” and so on… When Timothy was a young man the New Testament did not exist, the only thing that stems he was talking about are scriptures – which are only a portion of the Bible - from before that time. It could not have meant the whole Bible.

Bible Curses Church Fathers Who REMOVED Book of Revelations

There is at the end of the Bible a verse which says:

Rev 22:18 "For I testify to everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book (Revelations): if anyone adds to these things, God will add to him the plagues that are written in this book:
19. And if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, god shall take away his part from the Book of Life, from the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book. [Y. Estes]

“Let anyone who takes away from this book or adds to this book be cursed”. This to is sometimes pointed to me saying: Here is where it sums itself as a whole. But look again and you will see that when it says: Let no one change this book, it is talking about that last book, #66 (or is it #73 in the Catholic Bible?), the Book of Revelation. It has too, because any reference will tell you that the Book of Revelation was written before certain other parts of the Bible were written. It happens today to be stacked at the end, but there are other parts that came after, so it can not be referring to the entire book.

(Incidentally, according to different manuscripts much older than the King James Version, there are different words at the end of the Book of Revelation, so how would we resolve that matter? - Y.E.)

Note: The Book of Revelation was taken out of the Bible several times and then replaced and then taken out and replaced according to various Church Councils throughout Church history. Guess the Church Fathers didn't read the curse at the end of the book?

Whose Word Is It?

It is an extreme position held only by some Christian groups that the Bible – in its entirety - cover to cover is the revealed word of God in every word, but they do a clever thing when they mention this, or make this claim. They will say that the Bible in its entirety is the word of God; inerrant (no mistakes) in the original writings.

So if you go to the Bible and point out some mistakes that are in it you are going to be told: Those mistakes were not there in the original manuscript, they have crept in so that we see them there today.

They are going on problem in that position. There is a verse in the Bible Isaiah 40:8 which in fact is so well known that some Bibles printed it on the inside front cover as an introduction and it says : “ The grass weathers, the flower fades, but the word of our God stands forever”. Here is a claim in the Bible that the word of God will stand forever, it will not be corrupted, it won't be lost. So if today you find a mistake in the Bible you have two choices. Either that promise was false that when God said my word wont fade away, he was mistaken, or the portion which has the mistake in it was not a part of the word of God in the first place, because the promise was that it would be safeguarded, it would not be corrupted.

Are There Mistakes?

I have suggested many times that there are mistakes in the Bible and the accusation comes back very quickly: Show me one. Well there are hundreds. If you want to be specific I can mention few. You have for example at 2nd Samuel 10:18 a description of a war fought by David saying that he killed 7000 men and that he also killed 40000 men on horsebacks. In 1st Chronicles 19 it mentions the same episode saying that he killed 70000 men and the 40000 men were not on horsebacks, they were on foot. The point be what is the difference between the pedestrian and not is very fundamental.



How Did Judas Die?

Matthew 27:5 says that Judas Iscariot when he died he hung himself. Acts 1 says that, no he jumped off a cliff head first. If you study Logic very soon you will come in your course to what they call an “undecidable propositions” or “meaningless sentences” or statements that can not be decided because there is no contextual false. One of the classic examples sited is something called the Effeminites paradox. This man was Cretan and he said “Cretans always lie”, now was that statement true or false? If he was a Cretan and he says that they always lie is he lying? If he is not lying then he is telling the truth then the Cretans don’t always lie ! You see it can not be true and it can not be false, the statement turns back on itself. It is like saying “What I am telling you right now is a lie” would you believe that or not? You see the statement has no true content. It can not be true and it can not be false. If it is true it is always false. If it is false it is also true.

Well in the Bible at Titus 1:12 the writer is Paul and he is talking about the Cretans. He says that one of their own men – a prophet - said “Cretans always lie” and he says that what this man says is true. It is a small mistake, but the point is that it is a human mistake, you don’t find that if you carefully examine the true content of that statement. It can not be a true statement.

Who is the Author?

Now I come back to the Quran, and as I mentioned the speaker in the Quran is - in the first person - is God. The book claims throughout that it is the word of God. It names itself 70 times as the Quran. It talks about its own contents. It has self-reference. The Quran states in the first Sura after Fatiha that “This is the book, there is no doubt in it, it is a guidance for those who are conscious of God” and so on and so on… It begins that way and continues that way stressing that. And there is one very amazing statement in the Quran when you come to the fourth Sura 82nd Ayah which says to those who say Quran is something else than the word of God. It challenges them saying: “Have they not considered the Quran, if it came from someone other than God they will find in it many mistakes”. Some of you are students, would you dare to hand in a paper after you completed a research work or something at the bottom you put down there “You wont find mistakes in this”. Would you dare to challenge your professor that way?. Well the Quran does that. It is telling: If you really think you know where this came from then starts looking for mistakes because you wont find any. Another interesting thing the Quran does is that it quotes all its critics. There has never - in hundreds of years - ever been some suggestion as to where that book came from but that the Quran does not already mention that objection and reply to it. Many times you will find the Ayah saying something like: Do they say such and such and so, say to them such and such and so. In every case there is a reply. More than that the Quran claims that the evidence of its origin is in itself, and that if you look at this book you will be convinced.



Difference of Authority

So the difference in Christianity and Islam comes down to a difference of authority and appeal to authority. The Christian wants to appeal to the Bible and the Muslim wants to appeal to the Quran. You can not stop by saying: This is true because me book say it is, and somebody else would say something else is true because my book says differently, you can not stop at that point, and the Quran does not. The Christians may point to some words that it is recorded Jesus said and say this proves my point. But the Muslim does not simply open his book and say: No, no the Quran says this, because the Quran does not simply deny something the Bible says and say something else instead. The Quran takes the form of a rebuttal, it is a guidance as the opening says (Huda lil mutakeen). So that for every suggestion that the Christian may say: My Bible say such and such, the Quran will not simply say: No that is not true, it will say: Do they say such and such then ask them such and such. You have for example the Ayah that compares Jesus and Adam. There are those who may say that Jesus must have been God (Son of God) because he had no father. He had a woman who was his mother, but there was no human father. It was God that gave him life, so he must have been God’s son. The Quran reminds the Christian in one short sentence to remember Adam - who was his father ? - and in fact, who was his mother ? He did not have a father either and in fact he did not have a mother, but what does that make him? So that the likeness of Adam is the likeness of Jesus, they were nothing and then they became something; that they worship God.



Quran Invites - Not Demands

So that the Quran does not demand belief - the Quran invites belief, and here is the fundamental difference. It is not simply delivered as: Here is what you are to believe, but throughout the Quran the statements are always: Have you O man thought of such and such, have you considered so and so. It is always an invitation for you to look at the evidence; now what do you believe ?



Special Pleading of the Bible

The citation of the Bible very often takes the form of what is called in Argumentation: Special Pleading. Special Pleading is when implications are not consistent. When you take something and you say: Well that must mean this, but you don’t use the same argument to apply it to something else. To give an example, I have seen it in publications many times, stating that Jesus must have been God because he worked miracles. In other hand we know very well that there is no miracle ever worked by Jesus that is not also recorded in the Old Testament as worked by one of the prophets. You had amongst others, Elijah, who is reported to have cured the leper, raise the dead boy to life and to have multiplied bread for the people to eat - three of the most favourite miracles cited by Jesus. If the miracles worked by Jesus proved he was God, why don’t they prove Elijah was God ? This is Special Pleading, if you see what I mean. The implications are not consistent. If this implies that then in that case it must also imply the same thing. We have those who would say Jesus was God because he was taken up in the heaven. But the Bible also says the a certain Einah did not die he was taken up into the heaven by God. Whether it is true or not, who knows, but the point is if Jesus being taken up proves he is God, why does not it prove Einah was God? The same thing happened to him.

Clear Parts & Difficult Parts of Bible

I wrote to a man one time, who wrote a book about Christianity and I had some of the objections I mentioned to you now. And his reply to me was that I am making matters difficult to myself, that there are portions in the Bible that are crystal clear and that there are portions that are difficult, and that my problem was that I am looking at the difficult part instead of the clear parts. The problem is that this is an exercise in self deception - why are some parts clear and some parts difficult? It is because somebody decided what this clearly means, now that makes this very difficult. To give you an example, John Chapter 14 a certain man said to Jesus: Show us God, and Jesus said: If you have seen me you have seen God. Now without reading on the Christian will say: See Jesus claimed to be God, he said if you have seen me you have seen God. If that is crystal clear then you have a difficult portion when you go back just a few pages to Chapter 5 when another man came to Jesus and said show us God and he said you have never seen God you have never heard his voice. Now what did he mean there if on the other occasion he meant that he was God? Obviously you have made matters difficult by deciding what the first one meant. If you read on in Chapter 14 you will see what he went on to say. He was saying the closest you are going to seeing God are the works you see me doing.


Bible Does Not Claim Jesus Claimed to Be Son of God

It is a fact that the words “son of God” are not found on the lips of Jesus anywhere in the first three Gospel accounts, he was always calling himself the Son of Man. And it is a curious form of reasoning that I have seen so often that it is established from Bible that he claimed to be God because - look how the Jews reacted. They will say for example he said such and such and the Jews said he is blaspheming, he claimed to be God and they tried to stone him. So they argue that he must have been claiming to be God because look ! - the Jews tried to kill him. They said that’s what he was claiming. But the interesting thing is that all the evidence is then built on the fact that a person is saying: I believed that Jesus was the son of God because the Jews who killed him said that’s what he used to say ! His enemies used to say that, so he must have said it, this is what it amounts to. In other hand we have the words of Jesus saying he would keep the law, the law of Moses and we have the statement in the Bible, why did the Jews kill him ? Because he broke the law of Moses. Obviously the Jews misunderstood him, if he promised he would keep the law, but they killed him because he broke the law, they must have misunderstood him, or lied about him.

Writers of Bible - Out of Context

When I talk about the Bible and quote various verses here and there I am often accused of putting things out of context, to say you have lifted something out of what it was talking about and given it a meaning. I don’t want to respond to the accusation as such, but it doesn’t seem to occur to many people that perhaps those who wrote portions of the Bible in the first place were guilty of the same thing. Maybe they – some of those writers - believed a certain thing and in order to prove it quoted from their scriptures – the Old Testament, the Hebrew writings - quoted out of context to prove their point. There are examples of that kind of thing. In Matthew 2 it said that a king wanted to kill the young child Jesus so he with his family went to Egypt, and they stayed there until that king died, and then they came back.

When the writer of Matthew, whoever he was, because the name Matthew won't be found in the book of Matthew; when he described this event saying that he came back out of Egypt, he said: “ This was to fulfil a prophecy which is written” and then he quotes Hosea Chapter 11 “Out of Egypt I called my Son”. So he said because Jesus went to Egypt and then came back out of Egypt and we have this passage in the Hebrew scriptures “out of Egypt I called my son” Jesus must have been the son of God. If you look and see what he was quoting, Hosea 11:1 he quotes the second half of a complete sentence, the complete sentence reads: “When Israel was young I loved him and out of Egypt I called my son”. Israel the nation was considered as the son of God. Moses was told to go to Pharaoh and say to him: If you touch that nation of people, you touch my son; warning him, warning Pharaoh: don’t touch that nation, calling the nation “the son of God”. So that this is the only thing talked about in Hosea 11:1. “Out of Egypt I called my son” can only refer to the nation of Israel. I mentioned this point some months ago here in another talk, to which a young lady with us objected that Israel is a symbolic name for Jesus. You will have a hard time finding that anywhere in the Bible because it isn’t there. You can take an index of the Bible and lookup the word “Israel” everywhere the word occurs and you will find no where in any place that you can connect the word Israel with Jesus. But never mind - suppose it is true, read on, the second verse says “and after that he kept on worshipping Bal”, because this is what the Israelites were guilty of, very often they kept falling back into Idol worshipping. So if that “Israel” really meant Jesus and it means that Jesus is the son of God that came out of Egypt they must also mean that Jesus from time to time used to bow down to that idol Bal. You have to be consistent, and follow through on what it says. So the point is whoever wrote Matthew and Chapter 2 was trying to prove a point by quoting something out of context, and he undid himself, because if you follow through on it, it can not be so.

Quran Has Internal Evidences

Now I can come back to the claim the Quran makes that it has internal evidence of its origin. There are many many ways that you can look at this. As one example, if I single out somebody here and say: You know, I know your father - he is going to doubt that, he has never seen me with his father. He would say, how does he look like, is he tall short does he wear glasses? and so on, and if I give him the right answers pretty soon he will get convinced, “Oh yes, you did meet him”. If you apply the same kind of thinking when you look at the Quran, here is a book that says it came from the one who was there when the universe began. So you should be asking that one: So tell me something that proves it. Tell me something that shows me you must have been there when the universe was beginning. You will find in two different Ayahs the statement that all the creation began from a single point, and from this point it is expanding. In 1978 they gave the Noble prize to two people who proved that thats the case. It is the big bang origin of the universe. It was determined by the large radio receivers that they have for the telephone companies which were sensitive enough to pick up the transmissions from satellites and it kept finding background noise that they could not account for. Until the only explanation came to be, it is the left over energy from that original explosion which fits in exactly as would be predicted by the mathematical calculation of what would be this thing if the universe began from a single point and exploded outwards. So they confirmed that, but in 1978. Centuries before that here is the Quran saying the heavens and the earth in the beginning they were one piece and split and says in another Ayah : “of the heavens we are expanding it”.

Quran Has Exact Accuracy

Let me tell you about a personal investigation, it occurred to me that there are a number of things you can find in the Quran that give evidence to its origin – internal evidence. If the Quran is dictated from a perfect individual; it originates with God, then there should not be any wasted space, it should be very meaningful. There should be nothing that we don’t need that you can cut off, and it should not be missing anything. And so that everything in there should really be there for a specific purpose. And I got to thinking about the Ayah which I mentioned before, it says, the likeness of Jesus is the likeness of Adam. It an equation, it uses the Arabic word (mithel), it says Jesus, Adam, equal. You go to the index of the Quran, you look up the name ISA it is in the Quran 25 times, you lookup the name Adam it is there 25 times. They are equal, through scattered references but 25 of each. Follow that through and you will find that in the Quran there are 8 places were an Ayah says something is like something else, using this (Mithel), you will find in every case and take both sides of it whatever that word is look it up in the index and it will be lets say 110 times and lookup the other word and it will be said to be equal to the same 110. That is quite a project of co-ordination if you try to write a book that way yourself. So that everywhere you happened to mention that such and such is like such and such that then you check your index, filing system, or your IBM punch cards or whatever, to make sure that in this whole book you mentioned them both the same number of times. But that’s what you will find in the Quran.

Quran Provides Reason

What I am talking about is built on a thing that is called in Logic: Use and Mention of a Word. When you use a word, you are using its meaning. When you mention a word, you are talking about the symbol without the meaning. For example, if I say Toronto is a big city - I used the word Toronto as I meant this place Toronto is a big city. But if I say to you Toronto has 7 letters, I am not talking about this place Toronto, I am talking about this word - Toronto. So, the revelation is above reasoning, but it is not above reason. That is to say we are more apt not to find in the Quran something that is unreasonable, but we may find something that we would have never figured out for ourselves.

Unique Word Refers to Itself in Quran

The author of this sentence said if this book came from someone besides God then you will find in it many Ikhtalafan (inconsistencies). The word Ikhtilaf is found many times in the Quran. But the word Ikhtalafan is only found once in the Quran. So there are not many Ikhtilafan in the Quran, there is only one - where the sentence is mentioned. So you see how things are put together perfectly. It has been suggested to mankind: Find a mistake. Man could not get hold of a mistake, and he is very clever, because this sentence could also mean: Find many Iktilafan and so he quickly goes to the index to see if he can find many of them and there is only one... Sorry clever person.

[end of Dr. Gary Miller and Yusuf Estes]

Bible And Quran - Originally Both From Allah

Conclusion: Both the Bible and the Quran have come to us by way of Almighty God, then through His angel Gabriel and then to the prophets, peace be upon them. However, when the next step comes into play (that of the human beings faithfully transmitting it on to others and future generations) we find out that Allah has only perserved His Last and Final Revelation for all times. And He certainly did not need the humans to do that.

Respect For Holy Books

Muslims should respect the Bible because it does still contain some of the original teachings of Allah. But there is no need to go to Bible classes or purchase one to read to try to learn about what our purpose is here in this life. The Quran makes it clear that Allah has indeed, perfected our "way of life" for us and has conferred on us His favor and has chosen for us to submit to Him in Islam.

We would like to suggest to the non-Muslims to consider obtaining a Quran (order one free through our site if you like) and then investigate for themsleves what the Quran is really all about and what it might mean to them in their lives.

[Free Quran available at: http://islamtomorrow.com/free ]

Final comment from Yusuf Estes:

I would like to state that after years of studying the Bible and then learning the Arabic language to read the Quran as it was originally recited to Muhammad, peace be upon him, by the angel Gabriel, I have come to an amazing conclusion. It seems to me that the Bible and the Quran are most definitely from the exact same source and they compliment each other very nicely. In fact, it appears that the Bible does not contradict the Quran, except in the very same places where the Bible contradicts itself.

I started to to read this article because I thought it might have something to say of some interest to a non Muslim as it was supposedly written by former Christians. So I would expect them to be knowledgable.. Then I reached the statement...

~"Bible" is NOT in the Bible~

and my hopes for any kind of unbiased article evaporated. How on earth can someone who claimed to be a Christian at some point in their life.. And even a "learned Christian" at that make such a crass error!!!! Have they no comprehension as to what the term Bible means? Biblos... Meaning collection of books, which is what the Bible is... A collection of books.

Then they have the utter face by starting of with bold claims that they do not wish to put down or desecrete the Holy Bible... Then they go ahead and do just that!!

I am beginning to see there is no hope of talking rationally to muslims when it comes to matters of religion, your only aim is to convert to Islam, you do not care for the feelings or beliefs of others, and you will not stop with your hatchet job articles until all the world is Muslim and we all follow the Arabic culture. I'm so sad to think this. When I read articles like those above it makes me only think bad things of Islam and that's sad ... Because your prophet I'm sure never wished Islam to be thought of in negative terms. By the actions of some muslims in their efforts of Dawah it shows Islam in the worse light.

If Islam can only "win" by default by attempting to show other religions in error.. Then that is the worse kind of hollow victory.

I pray to The Lord my God to show His blessed mercy upon you and guide you. Nothing else matters... The opinions of scholars are but opinions of men and their opinions will eventually disappear and be replaced by those of others... Gods Word will go on forever. Gods Word is eternal.. And you would be well to heed Him.

Peace, may the God we both share love and bless you.

Frankly speaking I can not answer on behalf of those respectful eminent scholars. Of course they have stronger answers than mine.
I would rather write an answer to your post since I copied and pasted their precious article to our forum.


You make your hopes for any kind of unbiased article evaporated. The article is never "unbiased" you think it this way.
Concerning the meaning, I am sure they know the meaning, both of them were Christian missionaries and preachers, and I am sure they know more than me and you.

Yes, what ever the meaning is, it never changes the right that this book is man made. I do not know if (God) ordered the christian priests (during the early christianity) to make a book of (Old and New Testament, Hebrew Torah "Tanakh" and four Gospels)!
The meaning is the appearance, but what is important here is the core and important questions about the content.


You say "Then they have the utter face by starting of with bold claims that they do not wish to put down or desecrete the Holy Bible". Instead of writing this sentence it was better for you and all of us to write an answer to them not accusing them. Yes those " bold claims" are from Bible and to Bible. They use Bible to judge Bible. They raise objections to your belief in the Bible as a perfect book from God, but those objections are very accurate.
What amazes me is that some Christians run to accuse (Old Testament) of being fallible word of God to save their New Testament.

The Gospels were not written by eye witnesses, and there is time gap between the Gospels them selves and between Jesus and the Gospels. The absence of original copy in Aramaic language, the differences and contradictions between the books are ruining the belief that (Bible) is from God.

Where is the genuine copy of your Bible?
What language were the Gospels originally written in? Greek or Aramaic?

What was Jesus native language? Aramaic. Them why were the gospels written in Greek?

Imagine this series: from Aramaic to Hebrew, then from Latin to Greek, then from Latin to English, Arabic, Chinese, Polish......etc. How many mistakes and mistranslation and changes were made.

اقتباس:

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~"Bible" is NOT in the Bible~

and my hopes for any kind of unbiased article evaporated. How on earth can someone who claimed to be a Christian at some point in their life.. And even a "learned Christian" at that make such a crass error!!!! Have they no comprehension as to what the term Bible means? Biblos... Meaning collection of books, which is what the Bible is... A collection of books.
Then they have the utter face by starting of with bold claims that they do not wish to put down or desecrete the Holy Bible... Then they go ahead and do just that!!

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Our aim is clearing what is unclear. And spread the peaceful message of Islam. And like the Americans say we (bury the hatchet) rather than using it.
There are christian theologians who accuse Bible and write books and articles, not only Muslims.
And I want to tell you and request "never think bad things of Islam". Yes sure our dear Prophet never "wished Islam to be thought of in negative terms", and I am glad you wrote this sentence. Yes, blame the mistakes on us but neither on Islam neither nor our Prophet (Allah's blessing and peace be upon him).
When you say "By the actions of some muslims in their efforts of Dawah it shows Islam in the worse light." I can feel that you are exaggerating, somehow.

اقتباس:

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I am beginning to see there is no hope of talking rationally to muslims when it comes to matters of religion, your only aim is to convert to Islam, you do not care for the feelings or beliefs of others, and you will not stop with your hatchet job articles until all the world is Muslim and we all follow the Arabic culture. I'm so sad to think this. When I read articles like those above it makes me only think bad things of Islam and that's sad ... Because your prophet I'm sure never wished Islam to be thought of in negative terms. By the actions of some muslims in their efforts of Dawah it shows Islam in the worse light.

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A I said, we use your Bible and ask simple questions. We can say the same of what you said to christian missionaries and preachers.

اقتباس:

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If Islam can only "win" by default by attempting to show other religions in error.. Then that is the worse kind of hollow victory.

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اقتباس:

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Peace, may the God we both share love and bless you.

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Thank you, and the same to you

اقتباس:

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المشاركة الأصلية كتبت بواسطة هشيم

Frankly speaking I can not answer on behalf of those respectful eminent scholars. Of course they have stronger answers than mine.
I would rather write an answer to your post since I copied and pasted their precious article to our forum.

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Their answers are really no stronger than your own. It is their opinion based on their own point of view. This point of view is not shared by billions of Christians worldwide and so in the grand scheme of things counts for very little. At least from a Christian prospective.. Obviously muslims will continue to set great store by the opinions of such "scholars" I hesitate to use the term scholar, after all one mans scholar is another mans charlatan.

اقتباس:

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You make your hopes for any kind of unbiased article evaporated. The article is never "unbiased" you think it this way.
Concerning the meaning, I am sure they know the meaning, both of them were Christian missionaries and preachers, and I am sure they know more than me and you.

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what they once claimed to be means very little, in fact for any Christians who views themselves as part of the living gospel such claims ring hollow. For anyone who sees themselves as part of the living gospel knows there is no turning from this road, God has set our path. There are a great many people who claim to be Christian but in reality they are so far from the teachings and understanding of Christ Jesus they may as well tread another path it would be better for them. I find it strange that some members here revile "Christian missionaries" above all else, and yet when one turns coat he becomes an eminent scholar over night. You are welcome to these eminent gentlemen.

اقتباس:

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Yes, what ever the meaning is, it never changes the right that this book is man made. I do not know if (God) ordered the christian priests (during the early christianity) to make a book of (Old and New Testament, Hebrew Torah "Tanakh" and four Gospels)!
The meaning is the appearance, but what is important here is the core and important questions about the content.

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I do know that in my heart of hearts the God inspired the Bible. The message we have today is what we as Christians are meant to have. Christians have faith in their scriptures as you muslims have in yours. It amazes me that you should think we would not, as I'm sure if I was to suggest to you that your belief in the Quran was misplaced you would quite rightly be horrified. That's the nub of the question... It comes down to faith, true faith remains steadfast... Because it requires absolute trust in Gods ability to guide the souls of His creation is greater than the one who opposes him... Satan.

اقتباس:

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You say "Then they have the utter face by starting of with bold claims that they do not wish to put down or desecrete the Holy Bible". Instead of writing this sentence it was better for you and all of us to write an answer to them not accusing them. Yes those " bold claims" are from Bible and to Bible. They use Bible to judge Bible. They raise objections to your belief in the Bible as a perfect book from God, but those objections are very accurate.
What amazes me is that some Christians run to accuse (Old Testament) of being fallible word of God to save their New Testament.

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my criticism of the "scholars" and their article may have been harsh, and unchristian in nature, for that I ask the Lords forgiveness. They, like us all, will answer for their actions before almighty God.

اقتباس:

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The Gospels were not written by eye witnesses, and there is time gap between the Gospels them selves and between Jesus and the Gospels. The absence of original copy in Aramaic language, the differences and contradictions between the books are ruining the belief that (Bible) is from God.

Where is the genuine copy of your Bible?
What language were the Gospels originally written in? Greek or Aramaic?

What was Jesus native language? Aramaic. Them why were the gospels written in Greek?

Imagine this series: from Aramaic to Hebrew, then from Latin to Greek, then from Latin to English, Arabic, Chinese, Polish......etc. How many mistakes and mistranslation and changes were made.

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Really, this means very little... The oldest copies we have in existence owe their presence to an original manuscript. The question you should ask is how reliable do we believe the scribes who penned the copies were? Based on evidence we have we have every reason to believe they were meticulous in their work, after all they believed they were dealing with the Word of God. Here is a link on evaluating the evidence.. I hope you read it.

http://www.leaderu.com/orgs/probe/docs/bib-docu.html

peace to you.

اقتباس:

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المشاركة الأصلية كتبت بواسطة هشيم

Our aim is clearing what is unclear. And spread the peaceful message of Islam. And like the Americans say we (bury the hatchet) rather than using it.
There are christian theologians who accuse Bible and write books and articles, not only Muslims.
And I want to tell you and request "never think bad things of Islam". Yes sure our dear Prophet never "wished Islam to be thought of in negative terms", and I am glad you wrote this sentence. Yes, blame the mistakes on us but neither on Islam neither nor our Prophet (Allah's blessing and peace be upon him).
When you say "By the actions of some muslims in their efforts of Dawah it shows Islam in the worse light." I can feel that you are exaggerating, somehow.

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It is only unclear to yourselves... Seeing as you have no interest in the Bible I fail to see why it bothers you so much. For sure it is not only muslims who make it their life work to criticise and attempt to find fault with the Bible, however I would not go as far as to call them Christians :) at least not of much faith, if they had faith.. Then they would also have trust in God.. If they had trust then they would not feel the need to doubt Gods word. Seems obvious to me.

I don't feel I exaggerate when I say some muslims do more harm to Islam than any non Muslim could ever do. When I read some of the quite hateful things said about non muslims I wonder if they ever do read what prophet Mohammed said in regards to other religions. Or maybe I have misunderstood, when I believed Prophet Mohammed showed tolerance to non muslims... I did not think I did but it is possible. For this seeming bad opinion and intolerance towards non muslims does not seem to be a product of either Mohammed or Islam.. Or am I again misinformed in this matter. So, for this I do not blame Islam or your prophet... But muslims themselves are responsible and you should maybe wonder where such feelings come from, because I don't see from where this division stems from.

peace

When one knows how Christianity is formed, when one knows how this book is arranged, when one realizes how this book is written (for example hundreds of years after Jesus), when one only realizes that there were Nicea once upon a time, when one reads about the early history of Christianity,when one looks for (Trnityt decree) in Bible, when the differences and contradictions between the Old and New Testaments, ..... and the list goes on...

these are not (attempt to find fault with the Bible), these are rather simple questions every body ask about anything. But the problem here is (the answer) rather than anything else.

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I don't feel I exaggerate when I say some muslims do more harm to Islam than any non Muslim could ever do.

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Still this is not an excuse to blame Islam or run away from Islam. You look for a religion not a person. You look for Islam and want to know what is Islam not the persons and individuals. we are all humans not Prophets neither Angles.
No, you are not misunderstood, never.
Islam is about high morals, smile to the face of your friend, to help your neighbour what ever he is.. and so on. You can learn about Islam from the original source not from followers and individuals. We do not like to harm Islam and we do care about this, and we are sad when we represent a bad Muslim because we know there are who judges our peaceful religion through our behaviors, and this is not logic neither right, and this judgment is unfair.

اقتباس:

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I don't feel I exaggerate when I say some muslims do more harm to Islam than any non Muslim could ever do.

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Still this is not an excuse to blame Islam or run away from Islam. You look for a religion not a person. You look for Islam and want to know what is Islam not the persons and individuals. we are all humans not Prophets neither Angles.
No, you are not misunderstood, never.
Islam is about high morals, smile to the face of your friend, to help your neighbour what ever he is.. and so on. You can learn about Islam from the original source not from followers and individuals. We do not like to harm Islam and we do care about this, and we are sad when we represent a bad Muslim because we know there are who judges our peaceful religion through our behaviors, and this is not logic neither right, and this judgment is unfair.

اقتباس:

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When I read some of the quite hateful things said about non muslims I wonder if they ever do read what prophet Mohammed said in regards to other religions. Or maybe I have misunderstood, when I believed Prophet Mohammed showed tolerance to non muslims... I did not think I did but it is possible. For this seeming bad opinion and intolerance towards non muslims does not seem to be a product of either Mohammed or Islam.. Or am I again misinformed in this matter. So, for this I do not blame Islam or your prophet... But muslims themselves are responsible and you should maybe wonder where such feelings come from, because I don't see from where this division stems from.

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اقتباس:

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I don't feel I exaggerate when I say some muslims do more harm to Islam than any non Muslim could ever do.

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Still this is not an excuse to blame Islam or run away from Islam. You look for a religion not a person. You look for Islam and want to know what is Islam not the persons and individuals. we are all humans not Prophets neither Angles.
No, you are not misunderstood, never.
Islam is about high morals, smile to the face of your friend, to help your neighbour what ever he is.. and so on. You can learn about Islam from the original source not from followers and individuals. We do not like to harm Islam and we do care about this, and we are sad when we represent a bad Muslim because we know there are who judges our peaceful religion through our behaviors, and this is not logic neither right, and this judgment is unfair.
There are quite a a lot articles on internet tell you about our dear Prophet (Allah's peace and blessings be upon him) and Islam, Quran verses and hadiths help you to know more about morals and behaviors, and how Muslims is encouraged to do good and say good and refrain from harming others. It seems to me you know about this because you refer to our Prophet (Allah's peace and blessings be upon him) once more.
We Muslims have more and more orders and instructions concerning social relationships starting from family, neighbours, friends, even our dear Prophet (Allah's peace and blessings be upon him) taught us how to behave on roads and pavements. I can tell that there are not such thorough morals and ethics in Christianity.

No, you are not misunderstood neither misinformed. Our dear Prophet (Allah's peace and blessings be upon him) in deed showed tolerance to Non Muslims.

اقتباس:

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When I read some of the quite hateful things said about non muslims I wonder if they ever do read what prophet Mohammed said in regards to other religions. Or maybe I have misunderstood, when I believed Prophet Mohammed showed tolerance to non muslims... I did not think I did but it is possible. For this seeming bad opinion and intolerance towards non muslims does not seem to be a product of either Mohammed or Islam.. Or am I again misinformed in this matter. So, for this I do not blame Islam or your prophet... But muslims themselves are responsible and you should maybe wonder where such feelings come from, because I don't see from where this division stems from.

---

اقتباس:

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When I read some of the quite hateful things said about non muslims I wonder if they ever do read what prophet Mohammed said in regards to other religions. Or maybe I have misunderstood, when I believed Prophet Mohammed showed tolerance to non muslims... I did not think I did but it is possible. For this seeming bad opinion and intolerance towards non muslims does not seem to be a product of either Mohammed or Islam.. Or am I again misinformed in this matter. So, for this I do not blame Islam or your prophet... But muslims themselves are responsible and you should maybe wonder where such feelings come from, because I don't see from where this division stems from.

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In the name of Allah, the Entirely Merciful, the Especially Merciful

And if you had been rude [in speech] and harsh in heart, they would have disbanded from about you.

[QUOTE=هشيم;590207

Still this is not an excuse to blame Islam or run away from Islam. You look for a religion not a person. You look for Islam and want to know what is Islam not the persons and individuals. we are all humans not Prophets neither Angles.
No, you are not misunderstood, never.
Islam is about high morals, smile to the face of your friend, to help your neighbour what ever he is.. and so on. You can learn about Islam from the original source not from followers and individuals. We do not like to harm Islam and we do care about this, and we are sad when we represent a bad Muslim because we know there are who judges our peaceful religion through our behaviors, and this is not logic neither right, and this judgment is unfair.
There are quite a a lot articles on internet tell you about our dear Prophet (Allah's peace and blessings be upon him) and Islam, Quran verses and hadiths help you to know more about morals and behaviors, and how Muslims is encouraged to do good and say good and refrain from harming others. It seems to me you know about this because you refer to our Prophet (Allah's peace and blessings be upon him) once more.
We Muslims have more and more orders and instructions concerning social relationships starting from family, neighbours, friends, even our dear Prophet (Allah's peace and blessings be upon him) taught us how to behave on roads and pavements. I can tell that there are not such thorough morals and ethics in Christianity.

No, you are not misunderstood neither misinformed. Our dear Prophet (Allah's peace and blessings be upon him) in deed showed tolerance to Non Muslims.[/QUOTE]

I do not blame Islam for the actions of some muslims.. where did you get that impression? This I feel also should go both ways and muslims should not judge Christianity by the actions of the least admirable of "Christians"... For sure I know of some who think of themselves as Christians and are very far from Christ :( sad but true. Yet they are a minority. Also it seems to me muslims sometimes judge the immoral actions of the west as stemming from Christians, whereas theses actions are usually by people with no faith at all. We are all guilty of making unfair judgements... When in fact it is not our place to do so.

اقتباس:

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We Muslims have more and more orders and instructions concerning social relationships starting from family, neighbours, friends, even our dear Prophet (Allah's peace and blessings be upon him) taught us how to behave on roads and pavements. I can tell that there are not such thorough morals and ethics in Christianity.

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I do not see this plethora of orders and instructions that rule your every hour as a necessity when it comes to the worship of God. When you say your Prophet taught you how to behave on roads etc... Is this a requirement from the Quran or is it sunnah? If the latter then does this impinge on worship of God? Does God really mind that you eat with a particular hand or do certain things a certain way etc? How hard is it to intrinsically understand that good behaviour towards others is pleasing to God? Maybe Christians see the Holy Spirit guides in this way. It seems sometimes that God gives us our freedoms yet Islam takes them away and replaces them with rules that it's hard to see what they have to do with a Holy God. Apologies if my words seem harsh, I do not mean them to be.

Peace upon you.

Please, do not change the direction of the thread to another subject, and a subject irrelevant to the main subject.

Anyway it is not plethora, and it really hurts me to hear this from you referring our Quran and Sunnah, meanwhile you have more than 66 books in your bible and a bunch of contradictions and "shocking" facts that raise profound questions about your book's being genuine.

Anyway, I can see that you do not know very much about islam and Quran and Sunna and what is going on there. It is arranged and tidy, it is simple to learn and to follow. There are laws and rules arranging everything. There are experts in this field. there are Quranic verses guides us to this and shows us how to behave concerning Quran and Sunnah. It is a very detailed subject and need a special thread rather than a post.


Allah Almight says in Quran:
In the name of Allah, the Entirely Merciful, the Especially Merciful
Say, "If the sea were ink for [writing] the words of my Lord, the sea would be exhausted before the words of my Lord were exhausted, even if We brought the like of it as a supplement." (109) Al Kahf

Yes if Allah Almighty had mentioned everything in Quran, we would have had a huge book, and then you Non-Muslms, I am sure, have had a lot of questions.
Now You're Just Contradicting Yourself and always have two sets of rules, you the Non Muslims. If there were no guides and instructions in Islam, you would have asked why there is not any? and when we have you say "plethora" and ask questions about. Quran ans Islam is not according to your desire neither mine, it is Allah's revelation to our Prophet.

Not like your Bible, we cant put in it what we like and leave out what we do not.

اقتباس:

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I do not see this plethora of orders and instructions that rule your every hour as a necessity when it comes to the worship of God. When you say your Prophet taught you how to behave on roads etc... Is this a requirement from the Quran or is it sunnah? If the latter then does this impinge on worship of God? Does God really mind that you eat with a particular hand or do certain things a certain way etc? How hard is it to intrinsically understand that good behaviour towards others is pleasing to God? Maybe Christians see the Holy Spirit guides in this way. It seems sometimes that God gives us our freedoms yet Islam takes them away and replaces them with rules that it's hard to see what they have to do with a Holy God. Apologies if my words seem harsh, I do not mean them to be.

Peace upon you

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Peace upon you

اقتباس:

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المشاركة الأصلية كتبت بواسطة هشيم

Please, do not change the direction of the thread to another subject, and a subject irrelevant to the main subject.

Anyway it is not plethora, and it really hurts me to hear this from you referring our Quran and Sunnah, meanwhile you have more than 66 books in your bible and a bunch of contradictions and "shocking" facts that raise profound questions about your book's being genuine.

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please accept my sincere apology for any hurt caused it was not my intention. As I expect you also do not wish to hurt me when you make your claims in regards to the Bible, yet, it is often painful to read what muslims say about Gods message.. The Bible, and that's what it is to me .. Gods divine message.. I do not see through your eyes contradictions and "shocking" facts and for me there are no doubts that the Bible is a Holy Book if not in your mind then most definitely in mine and billions of other Christians.

اقتباس:

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Anyway, I can see that you do not know very much about islam and Quran and Sunna and what is going on there. It is arranged and tidy, it is simple to learn and to follow. There are laws and rules arranging everything. There are experts in this field. there are Quranic verses guides us to this and shows us how to behave concerning Quran and Sunnah. It is a very detailed subject and need a special thread rather than a post.

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I do not claim to understand the details in the Quran or Sunnah. I am not a Muslim and do not know any Islamic scholars to assist me with my reading and interpretation of the Quran. It it does not appear arranged or tidy to my mind but then I am used to the Bible which gives more detail... At least to my mind.. And I guess we learn the same lessons from each of our respective Books in different ways.

اقتباس:

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Allah Almight says in Quran:
In the name of Allah, the Entirely Merciful, the Especially Merciful
Say, "If the sea were ink for [writing] the words of my Lord, the sea would be exhausted before the words of my Lord were exhausted, even if We brought the like of it as a supplement." (109) Al Kahf

Yes if Allah Almighty had mentioned everything in Quran, we would have had a huge book, and then you Non-Muslms, I am sure, have had a lot of questions.
Now You're Just Contradicting Yourself and always have two sets of rules, you the Non Muslims. If there were no guides and instructions in Islam, you would have asked why there is not any? and when we have you say "plethora" and ask questions about. Quran ans Islam is not according to your desire neither mine, it is Allah's revelation to our Prophet.

Not like your Bible, we cant put in it what we like and leave out what we do not.

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Its immaterial how many rules you have or don't have, what I don't understand is how some of the rules have anything to do with a persons spiritual well being or making oneself right with God. Just as you believe the Quran is Gods revelation I believe the Holy Bible is also Gods divine message to His people. I am greatly offended that you think we regard it so lightly that we can put in what we like and leave out what we we do not. It's very arrogant of you to believe that others do not hold their scriptures in the highest esteem as you hold your own.

Peace to you.

We, Muslims, really do not like causing offences and we just can't stand hurting others, it is one of our principles for arguing with anyone. According to myself when I raise questions about your Bible, those questions are asked even by Christians themselves bout your Bible and its early history...etc. I know those questions are profound and are touching the core of your believe.
Please accept our sincere apology for any hurt caused we do not mean it.

Peace be upon you.

اقتباس:

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please accept my sincere apology for any hurt caused it was not my intention. As I expect you also do not wish to hurt me when you make your claims in regards to the Bible, yet, it is often painful to read what muslims say about Gods message..

Just as you believe the Quran is Gods revelation I believe the Holy Bible is also Gods divine message to His people. I am greatly offended that you think we regard it so lightly that we can put in what we like and leave out what we we do not. It's very arrogant of you to believe that others do not hold their scriptures in the highest esteem as you hold your own.

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Thank you. May God bless you.