Salam Aleikom

آخـــر الـــمـــشـــاركــــات


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Salam Aleikom

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  1. #1
    German.Bergheim's Avatar
    German.Bergheim is offline عضو جديد
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    Default Salam Aleikom

    To start with: I am German, 47 years old and married with my wife from Morocco and of course she is moslem

    I have been introduced to this forum by her to discuss about problems of converting to Islam

    On the other hand I have honestly to confess that I do not have any problem because according to my opinion humans are humans independant from their religion whether christian or moslem or any other religion

    Thus the question turns up: why converting to Islam

    Humanity comes first

    The human being comes first always be it by birth, by life or by death

    noone has the right to judge about other people to stipulate any belief

    As I have been brought up and educated in Germany or better Europe it goes without saying that my attitude to all aspects of life religion included are christian-shaped

    Although grown up in christian surroundings I would not define myself as the typical Christian

    My character is specially me and so my glance to religion is also

    My mind and spirit are the result of having studied latin, old greek, philosophy, psychology added by my personal experiences in my life

    I am a profound person, do not like to scratch the surface only

    I consider myself a little intelectual, comprehensive, openminded, capable of discussing topics adversarial but with respect

    Now it is up to you to judge about me, whether I am high brow, arrogant or anything else

    But do me a favour, discuss openly by sticking to the point without calling me disregardful to religion or God

    If someone here prefers to tease me as a blasphemer, you do not know me personnally

    I have my values and qualities and maybe I am a more religious and responsable person than these persons that name themselves religious and submit to God

    So do not forget, we all are Humans on one earth and respect and responsibility are mandatory from all of us towards all of us
    نقره لتكبير أو تصغير الصورة ونقرتين لعرض الصورة في صفحة مستقلة بحجمها الطبيعي

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    بسم الله الرحمن الرحيم

    You are Welcome Mr. German.Bergheim and I/m really happy to talk to you here at this forum and discuss each other in many issues that are related to religion and other aspects of life

    So first of all I would like to welcome you here and I will have my first reply on your gentle letter

    hope you will enjoy the discussion here


    سَلامٌ مِنْ صَبا بَرَدى أَرَقُّ ....ودمعٌ لا يُكَفْكَفُ يا دمشقُ

    ومَعْذِرَةَ اليراعةِ والقوافي .... جلاءُ الرِّزءِ عَنْ وَصْفٍ يُدَّقُ

    وذكرى عن خواطرِها لقلبي .... إليكِ تلفّتٌ أَبداً وخَفْقُ

  3. #3
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    In the name of Allah the Compassionate, the Merciful

    Why Religion??

    As you know my friend German.Bergheim, God has created the world and created us to worship him and to live in this world by his teachings. If we do that we will be happy at life and after death.
    That's why, God has sent many prophets to teach the humans the right way to God.
    People on earth , for sorry, have mislead the way to God because of their bad thoughts and because of disobeying God.

    You know that there are many religions on earth. But Is all the religions on earth are true??
    I will answer in my next reply
    سَلامٌ مِنْ صَبا بَرَدى أَرَقُّ ....ودمعٌ لا يُكَفْكَفُ يا دمشقُ

    ومَعْذِرَةَ اليراعةِ والقوافي .... جلاءُ الرِّزءِ عَنْ وَصْفٍ يُدَّقُ

    وذكرى عن خواطرِها لقلبي .... إليكِ تلفّتٌ أَبداً وخَفْقُ

  4. #4
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    In the name of Allah the Compassionate, the Merciful

    Why Islam??

    As I told you my friend, there are many religions on earth. And these religions some of them are from God, and others are human made.
    To explain more, we Muslims, believe that Judaism and Christianity are two religions from God, but for sorry, the followers of these two religions mislead the way to God.
    You may ask me how!! I tell you that the Judaism changed god teachings and make God similar to humans by describing him doing things similar to humans like wrestling, eating ...etc
    The Christians also worship three Gods in one, and claim that Jesus is another god ...

    That's why God sent prophet Mohammad with the Holy Quran to tell people that the real God is the one who has the supreme power over everything, who is one with no partner and he is God who has no needs like humans.
    And God told us that Christians and Jews have changed God's teachings and that's why they are wrong.

    This is an introduction for our dialogue here, and I would like to hear your comment after this
    I'm waiting your reply
    سَلامٌ مِنْ صَبا بَرَدى أَرَقُّ ....ودمعٌ لا يُكَفْكَفُ يا دمشقُ

    ومَعْذِرَةَ اليراعةِ والقوافي .... جلاءُ الرِّزءِ عَنْ وَصْفٍ يُدَّقُ

    وذكرى عن خواطرِها لقلبي .... إليكِ تلفّتٌ أَبداً وخَفْقُ

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    U R welcome our guest in our forum and i hope brother Abu Ali Alfelistine answer ur questions


    best wishes
    Last edited by ابو علي الفلسطيني; 18-11-2010 at 08:17 PM. Reason: جزاك الله خيرا اخي الحبيب ... سنعرض الاسئلة فيما بعد
    نقره لتكبير أو تصغير الصورة ونقرتين لعرض الصورة في صفحة مستقلة بحجمها الطبيعي
    نقره لتكبير أو تصغير الصورة ونقرتين لعرض الصورة في صفحة مستقلة بحجمها الطبيعي
    O en iyi ordu... Hey iyi-e
    Sen cesur... Seçin denizde bir
    Kalkan el... Dagger elinde
    Mystery Aloaadi hakkında... Hey iyi-e
    Eğer her şey... denizinde destekler
    Biz çağrı... Allahu Akbar
    Allah büyüktür... Allahu Akbar
    Bizim askeri edelim... Her zaman Muzafferabad

  6. #6
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    Quote
    Quote Originally Posted by German.Bergheim View Post

    I have been introduced to this forum by her to discuss about problems of converting to Islam
    welcome to the forum colleague ,

    Quote
    Quote Originally Posted by German.Bergheim View Post

    On the other hand I have honestly to confess that I do not have any problem because according to my opinion humans are humans independant from their religion whether christian or moslem or any other religion

    Thus the question turns up: why converting to Islam
    simply because Islam means to surrender to Allah's will & guidance .

    Would you tell us why not convert to Islam ? What makes Islam not your way of life?



    Quote
    Quote Originally Posted by German.Bergheim View Post
    noone has the right to judge about other people to stipulate any belief
    I really don't know what you mean by saying this , Islam doesn't force people to believe as Allah said to prophet Mohammed P.B.U.H. : "18|29|Say: (It is) the truth from the Lord of you (all). Then whosoever will, let him believe, and whosoever will, let him disbelieve" .




    Quote
    Quote Originally Posted by German.Bergheim View Post

    Now it is up to you to judge about me, whether I am high brow, arrogant or anything else

    But do me a favour, discuss openly by sticking to the point without calling me disregardful to religion or God
    we don't wanna call you so, but I think that you were talking about our being humans ....so that it doesn't matter which faith one chooses to follow .

    This is what I conclude.

    Quote
    Quote Originally Posted by German.Bergheim View Post
    If someone here prefers to tease me as a blasphemer, you do not know me personnally
    I think that nobody here in this forum wants to tease you .
    That's not an option.
    & by the way we don't consider non - moslems villain , but we think that Good deeds of a non-moslem will be of no avail on Day of Judgement.




    Quote
    Quote Originally Posted by German.Bergheim View Post
    I have my values and qualities and maybe I am a more religious and responsable person than these persons that name themselves religious and submit to God
    Well here you consider ethics more reliable than faith.


    6|48|We send not the messengers save as bearers of good news and warners. Whoso believeth and doeth right, there shall no fear come upon them neither shall they grieve.

    2|177|It is not righteousness that ye turn your faces to the East and the West; but righteous is he who believeth in Allah and the Last Day and the angels and the Scripture and the Prophets; and giveth his wealth, for love of Him, to kinsfolk and to orphans and the needy and the wayfarer and to those who ask, and to set slaves free; and observeth proper worship and payeth the poor due. And those who keep their treaty when they make one, and the patient in tribulation and adversity and time of stress. Such are they who are sincere. Such are the God fearing.

    Quote
    Quote Originally Posted by German.Bergheim View Post
    So do not forget, we all are Humans on one earth and respect and responsibility are mandatory from all of us towards all of us
    of course.
    Last edited by الفضة; 18-11-2010 at 08:48 PM.

  7. #7
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    we're waiting to hear from you colleague

  8. #8
    German.Bergheim's Avatar
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    Yes, thank you for your welcome and enjoy our sharp, but fair, discussion
    As I am not able to read Arab, I am not able to address you personnally but be assured, that I will answer your issues as best as I can

    So now: medias in res, directly to the point:

    I stand for christianity in my belief, this means that I speak from my "evangelischem" point of view, as a Christian Protestant

    In our eyes religion is not neither an agenda neither a timetable
    From my point of view religion demands reponsability from the human

    And why this?

    Yes, because it is true, religion is human-made This does not imply anything good or bad
    The creation of the world is something phantastic, nobody is able to understand that

    So religion is a measure to make it understandable, the creation of the world, the nature as well as the comprehension of humans

    My approach to religion is human, we all are not Christians, nor Muslems, nor of other religion, WE are HUMANS

    Why the world, the nature and the humans are created, nobody knows, really nobody knows, so religion is a good measure to understand, to comprehend and also to cope with the fascination of creation

    You wrote [COLOR="Lime"]God has created the world and created us to worship him and to live in this world by his teachings. If we do that we will be happy at life and after death[/COLOR

    According to my opinion this is wrong
    In contrary, this proves that religion is human-made
    It is a typically human trait to claim for God that he needs us to worship him
    If I were a king, then it would be human to raise my self-esteem by my inferiors worshipping me
    If I am a public or private authority, then it would be my trait and need to be admired, to be accepted, to be popular

    How can we proclaim that God wants to be worshipped, this is typically human
    Yes, the world and the nature with human beings is fascinating This is true and nobody can deny it
    If somebody tells me, human’s duty is to worship this will make me think that God needs us humans and that is wrong
    Furthermore you write: and he is God who has no needs like humansExactly, so God does not need us

    More-over you write: The Christians also worship three Gods in one, and claim that Jesus is another god
    This is not correct, there is one God, the Father, Jesus, his Son and the Spirit, this is called Trinität
    And on my behalf I do not worship, I believe or you can say I verify my responsibility in my daily life and I am the only one to be responsible

    As I said in the beginning Christianity is neither an agenda, neither a timetable and this is the evident difference between Christianity and Islam
    Christianity does not want followers on its behalf, Christianity demands responsibility, maturity
    For some people this is a great problem They prefer having rules how to behave, but Christianity from the protestant point of view needs people to be mature, to assess from their own
    Unfortunately humans are egoistic and selfish, so we have always problems in policy, in economy, ecology, sociology, paedagogy and so on and so on until we come to religion, there we come to different opinions, believes also, so are humans

    One last question in the end?

    Are Muslems better humans than Christians
    Are Christians better humans than Muslems
    Are Jewish better humans thanChristians or Muslems

    No, not at all,

    humans are equal all over the world
    There is no human preferred or discriminated, we all are human
    نقره لتكبير أو تصغير الصورة ونقرتين لعرض الصورة في صفحة مستقلة بحجمها الطبيعي

  9. #9
    د/مسلمة's Avatar
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    First of all, you are welcome in our forum

    I hope you enjoy your discussion with us

    Quote
    Quote Originally Posted by German.Bergheim View Post


    You wrote God has created the world and created us to worship him and to live in this world by his teachings. If we do that we will be happy at life and after death

    According to my opinion this is wrong
    In contrary, this proves that religion is human-made
    It is a typically human trait to claim for God that he needs us to worship him
    If I were a king, then it would be human to raise my self-esteem by my inferiors worshipping me
    If I am a public or private authority, then it would be my trait and need to be admired, to be accepted, to be popular

    How can we proclaim that God wants to be worshipped, this is typically human
    Yes, the world and the nature with human beings is fascinating This is true and nobody can deny it
    If somebody tells me, human’s duty is to worship this will make me think that God needs us humans and that is wrong
    So why did God create human according to Christianity?

    _____________

    Note: for proper quoting

    first: copy the text you need to quote --> then highlight it
    --> then press on this icon
    نقره لتكبير أو تصغير الصورة ونقرتين لعرض الصورة في صفحة مستقلة بحجمها الطبيعي

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    In the name of Allah the Compassionate, the Merciful

    Thank you my friend for your post and I have some comments on it, hopping that you will read them with an open mind.

    you say:

    Quote
    I stand for christianity in my belief, this means that I speak from my "evangelischem" point of view, as a Christian Protestant
    I will take this into consideration in our discussions.

    Quote
    From my point of view religion demands reponsability from the human
    You are right.

    Quote
    My approach to religion is human, we all are not Christians, nor Muslems, nor of other religion, WE are HUMANS
    Yes, we are humans. God has created everything for the benefit of the human beings.
    Quote
    Why the world, the nature and the humans are created, nobody knows, really nobody knows

    I disagree with you my friend. If we say that, then this means that God has created everything without knowing why he did this !!!! and this is not true for many reasons...

    God has created the universe and everything in this planet for reasonable reasons ... God cannot do anything that may appear to us as a non-sense action or unreasonable...
    we are created to worship God and to glorify him.... to thank him for his good things that he makes to us ... and i will explain this ...through my post


    Quote
    If somebody tells me, human’s duty is to worship this will make me think that God needs us humans and that is wrong

    Our worship to God doesn't mean that he needs us to worship him... and if we don't he will be weak ...
    no ... our worship to God is to glorify him ... and ti show our admission in his power and to show our commitment towards his teachings ...

    and let me ask you a question:
    why Christians go to church in sunday?? and why Jesus himself was praying to God as mentioned in the Bible and here is the verse:
    One of those days Jesus went out to a mountainside to pray, and spent the night praying to God. Luke 6:12

    does God needs Jesus pray?? of course not, but Jesus was doing this to obey God's teachings.
    this is why we worship God

    Quote
    This is not correct, there is one God, the Father, Jesus, his Son and the Spirit, this is called Trinität
    the trinity in Christianity means that you worship three Gods not one... and by the way, the word (trinity) never mentioned in the Bible... and if we read the Bible we will find out that these three gods are separate from each other ... so you don't actually believe in one God

    Quote
    humans are equal all over the world

    Islam doesn't say that people who believe in Christianity or other religions are not human... but we must know that our right believe in God determines our humanity...
    Throughout the history, people wear treated according to thier race and their color...
    you see what America is doing in the world ... so do all the human are treated the same from Christians??
    No, ...
    Being a Muslim doesn't mean you are not a human anymore ... but believe me you will not feel yourself a human until you follow Islam ... because it is the only religion on earth who belive in one God ... who respect the others and treat them the
    same ...

    I am wating your comment
    سَلامٌ مِنْ صَبا بَرَدى أَرَقُّ ....ودمعٌ لا يُكَفْكَفُ يا دمشقُ

    ومَعْذِرَةَ اليراعةِ والقوافي .... جلاءُ الرِّزءِ عَنْ وَصْفٍ يُدَّقُ

    وذكرى عن خواطرِها لقلبي .... إليكِ تلفّتٌ أَبداً وخَفْقُ

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Salam Aleikom