greetings Huria, firstly I feel your thread would be better named "which makes more sense Islam or a muslims interpretation of Christianity".. Because that's what you have here in your portrayal of Christianity. Which is not according to The Bible or Christian doctrine. So is it fair to say which makes more sense if you do not understand what you are making comparison with? Christians don't believe God left mankind without guidance for thousands of years.. Because we have the Torah and the Gospel and all the teachings of the Prophets from Abraham to Jesus. Jesus said with Him it was finished that's why we are not expecting another prophet... Also we are warned that any prophet who subsequently comes with a message that does not proclaim Jesus as Lord, then that is a false prophet and false revelation and we should not be following such. Many have come and many have been rejected. Not only is Islam's message different it is diametrically opposed to Christianity... On the key points it proposes the opposite. So I see that has having massive consequences on my eternal salvation and so cannot blindly accept such on the basis of one mans testimony as a prophet, without clear evidence. I have not seen that clear evidence, the fact that many have and converted to Islam means nothing.. As each person has an individual journey.
اقتباس:
Islam
God is one the creator of the universe, God in Arabic is Allah. Arab Christians also call God (Allah).
Christianity
“The One God exists in Three Persons and One Substance." God the father, God the son, and God the Holy Spirit., and those three are one, and equal.
Although Christians say they are equal, you will never hear them say it in any other order except father – son – Holy Spirit. If they are equal can they say Holy Spirit – son – father?
According to the doctrine of the Trinity, the Father and Son are co-equal. If that is true, how can the Father be (in any way) greater than Jesus? “I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I.”
you start off correctly enough, One God exists in three persons and one substance... Though I would have said essence rather than substance. However, you are in error when you say we believe they are equal. As they are not equal in authority, as all authority is with the Father.. GOD. Neither the Son.. (Gods Word - Jesus) or the Spirit work independently of the Father. That is why Jesus said the Father is greater than I.. And why Jesus also said He (Jesus) will send the Spirit (Paraclete) to guide the disciples after His ascension. So we will never say any other than God the Father, Jesus and the Holy Spirit... We know all worship is to God.. His Word and Spirit are God. Anyway, enough.. I don't want to cabbage your head with stuff you can't understand, and really you don't need to as a Muslim it's not for you to worry about.
اقتباس:
Is it clear who is God from the book?
اقتباس:
Islam
It is crystal clear who is God in Islam, one God, the creators, and no partners to associate with him in worship. The Quran goes in length about Allah, and his attributes, and his 99 names, for example The Master of the Universe," as stated in Verses 22-23, Chapter 26 of the Holy Quran, The Beneficent, The Merciful, “There is nothing like unto Him, and He is The Hearer, The Seer “ (Al-Shoura, 42: 11), and the many attributes of Allah.
Christianity
It is not clear from the bible about the trinity, there is no single verse in the whole bible about the 3 gods in one. The only verses in the whole Bible that explicitly ties God, Jesus, and the Holy Spirit in one "Triune" being is the verse of 1 John 5:7, it has been taken out of most English translations bible because "The text about the three heavenly witnesses (I John 5:7 KJV) is not an authentic part of the New Testament." [The Interpreter's Dictionary of the Bible, Vol. 4, p.711, Abingdon Press.]”
If that concept was so important, why is it not in the bible (the guidance for followers)? Leave it for interpretation based on people’s wishes and desires? If you give the bible to someone who never heard of trinity, and ask them to extract this out, they will not. It is like giving someone a title of a book, how to learn French in 10 days, you read the whole books, and it has nothing to do with French, the same could be said about the trinity and the bible.
this is your problem, you believe that because the trinity is not mentioned in the Bible then it was simply made up. You won't find any verse that mentions three gods in one because that's NOT what the trinity doctrine stands for. The trinity is NOT biblical teaching and you will not find any verses saying it is, it's a term arrived at, after great study of the scriptures over hundreds of years in an effort to explain the nature of God as told by God Himself through His prophets. The word Tawheed is not to be found in the Quran .. But would you deny the concept of Gods oneness is found within its pages? In fact, muslims cannot satisfactorily explain the concept of "oneness" .. A thread exists here where a past member issued a challenge to muslims to explain exactly that, it remains unanswered. There are many verses in the Bible both OT and NT that point to Gods triune nature or a plurality in the Godhead if you wish.. John 5:7 is not one of them. Besides common sense dictates that if the creation reflects the creator then absolute oneness would exist in nature... Does it?
اقتباس:
Islam
It is very clear from the Quran who to worship. Many verses in the Quran ,Allah tell us to worship him, for example “Say: He is Allah, (the) One; (1)Allah, the Eternal; (2)He did not beget (give birth) and He was not begotten (given birth to); (3)And there has never been anyone equal to Him. (4) (112: 1- 4). “And I (Allah) created not the jinn and mankind except that they should worship Me (Alone).” [Az-Zariyat 51:56]
“And your Lord has decreed that you worship none but Him…” [Al-Isra’ 17:23]
“Say (O Muhammad P.B.U.H): “Come, I will recite what your Lord has prohibited you from: Join not anything in worship with Him….” [Al-An’am 6:151]
Every Muslim in His Five Prayers confirms this Belief:
“You (Alone) we worship, and You (Alone) we ask for help (for each and everything)” [Al-Fatihah 1:5]
Christianity
Again it is not clear, there is no single verse of Jesus sayings in the bible, which explicitly state to worship him, or that he is one of three God/s. in fact the bible states that Jesus peace be upon him was praying to someone “ God, my God, why have you forsaken me"? (cf. Mark 15:34; Matthew 27:46) Was he praying to himself? If so, was he complaining to himself about why he had forsaken himself?
“One of those days Jesus went out to a mountainside to pray, and spent the night praying to God” Luke 6:12 who was he praying to? To himself?
there is no verse with Jesus saying "worship me".. However, there are many instances where He accepted worship and did not rebuke those who worshipped Him. Just because Jesus did not say the direct words.. "I am divine" does not mean he did not imply such indirectly and by His actions. As for Jesus not saying He was one of three gods... Well, that quite frankly is offensive! All His teaching was to show us the ONE true God.. There has only ever been ONE God in Christianity..
Jesus always prayed to the Father and taught us to do the same. So your inferences aren't applicable.
اقتباس:
The messengers/ prophets.
اقتباس:
Islam
God created Adam, and then thought our father how to repent, after he disobeyed God, and thought him who our enemy was. Adam peace be upon him was a messenger to his children, and he was the first messenger on Earth, the message was the same, worship one God, and do not associate any partners with him and follow the messenger. Humans are not sinless but messengers are protected from major sins but not from minor sins .
Allah has established proof against His servants by sending the Messengers and sending down the Books. They were not sent to one nation to the exclusion of others. Rather they were sent to all nations, in different places and at different times, as Allah say
“Verily! We have sent you with the truth, a bearer of glad tidings, and a warner. And there never was a nation but a warner had passed among them.” [Faatir 3524]
Muslims have to believe in all the prophets and messengers of God, equally, without distinction. In the Holy Quran (2:136, 285, and 3:84 etc.) it is stated clearly: "We make no distinction between them".
“Indeed, We sent Nuh (Noah) to his people and he said: “O my people! Worship Allah! You have no other Ilah (God) but Him. Certainly, I fear for you the torment of a Great Day!” [Al-A’raf 7: 59]
The Quran mentions the names of 25 prophets and indicates there were others. It says:
“Of some messengers We have already told you the story; of others We have not; - and to Moses God spoke direct.” (Quran 4:164)
The Names of the 25 Prophets Mentioned are as follows:
Adam
Idris (Enoch)
Nuh (Noah)
Hud (Heber)
Salih (Methusaleh)
Lut (Lot)
Ibrahim (Abraham)
Ismail (Ishmael)
Ishaq (Isaac)
Yaqub (Jacob)
Yusuf (Joseph)
Shu’aib (Jethro)
Ayyub (Job)
Dhulkifl (Ezekiel)
Musa (Moses)
Harun (Aaron)
Dawud (David)
Sulayman (Solomon)
Ilias (Elias)
Alyasa (Elisha)
Yunus (Jonah)
Zakariya (Zachariah)
Yahya (John the Baptist)
Isa (Jesus)
Muhammad
So Muhammad peace be upon him did not come with a new message, it was the same teaching of all the messengers before him including Ibrahim, Jesus, and Moses peace be upon them all. The message stayed the same, worship one God without any partners.
We've already covered the whole Adam thing.. I would just reiterate that the idea you have of messengers being protected against major sins whilst being able to commit minor sins, is unworkable. God gave us free will, God allowed Adam the free will to commit the greatest sin against God He could.. Why would God then take that free will away or reduce it for prophets? It's tantamount to God saying.. "Shouldn't have given mankind free will... I will in future for certain people take away some of that free will to protect them from making bad choices". Besides my believing this protections against major sins aren't you deciding yourself what constitutes a major sin before God? We have no such illusions of grandeur.. A sin is a sin, none are protected as by God given free will the choice remains our own. We answer for our choices if we choose wrongly.. It's simples.
I won't list the Biblical prophets... Men and women.. They are too numerous there's about 135 named prophets but a great many others besides. The majority of these prophets foretold the coming of the Messiah, and how mankind would be saved by Him. Others brought revelations for certain people at certain crucial times in the history of Gods chosen people. Others authored Covenants with God for people to live by. It was never only one message of worship God alone with no partners... Gods chosen people were already doing that, except for some times they lapsed into idolatry and for that they were punished.
اقتباس:
You would expect that major events such as the crucifixion and the resurrection of Christ, that make up the entire case for Christianity, to be at least prophesied by the prophets/ messengers in the old testament, without any ambiguity, and without any deliberate mistranslations and lies. The Truth and the sad reality for the believers in the crucifixion, "trinity", doesn't even exist in the entire Bible.
So what were the messengers teaching before the coming of “son of God”?
The same massage of Islam “.. None has the right to be worshipped but God, the One and the Only True God…” (Quran 3:62)
“Thou shalt have no other gods before me “Exodus 20:3 = Deuteronomy 5:7
Even Jesus peace be upon him said the same [And one of the scribes came, and … asked him, Which is the first commandment of all? And Jesus answered him, The first of all the commandments is, Hear, O Israel; The Lord our God is one Lord:] (Mark 12:28-29, KJV)
[Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfill.] (Matthew 5:17)
In fact according to the bible the prophets prayed the way Muslims pray
"And he (Jesus) went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed (Matthew 26:39)
"And Moses made haste, and bowed his head toward the earth, and worshipped." (Exodus 34:8)
And Joshua fell on his face to the earth, and did worship (Joshua 5:14)
Yes, you would expect to find the major events the birth, death and resurrection of The Christ foretold. Which they are. I think you misunderstand the biblical prophets and see them in the same way as you see your prophet of Islam. The prophets brought an understanding of who God was, an understanding of a knowable God, a God who wished to commune with His creation, a God who guided His creation and set them rules to live by, a God who was merciful when through weakness those rules were broken, a God who ensured through the perfect plan and the greatest act of agape love His creation would be redeemed.
اقتباس:
Islam is the religion, which was given to Adam peace be upon him the first man and the first prophet of Allah, and it was the religion of all the prophets, may Allah exalt their mention, sent by Allah to humankind. Islam means the complete submission and obedience to Allah (God). Therefore, all prophets were indeed MUSLIMS because they were true submitters to the will of ALLAH, the Creator. Prophet Muhammad peace upon him was the seal of prophets, he was sent to present Allah's revelation in its final form and for the last time. This was necessary because the message delivered by the previous Prophets and Messengers, peace upon them all, had been corrupted or distorted by their followers. Allah took it upon Himself to guard the last message (i.e. the Quran) from corruption. He says in the Quran :"Verily, it is We Who have sent down the message (i. e., the Quran) and surely, We will be its guardian.” [Quran 15:9]
if the only requirement of being considered a Muslim is submitting to God completely, then why are the Jews and Christians who submit to God every day of their lives with sincere hearts and love that knows no bounds not considered muslims?
as for the whole corruption issue of the previous scriptures.. Best not go there, as we know you can offer no real proof of any such claim. There's enough been said already, and despite the claim that proof was there none was produced.
اقتباس:
In contrast the trinity in Christianity does not make any sense,
اقتباس:
“The One God exists in Three Persons and One Substance." God the father, God the son, and God the Holy Spirit., and those three are one, and equal. Do the scriptures show Jesus and his Father to be co-equal? Jesus himself answers at John 14:28, "The Father is greater than I am." Non of the prophets taught trinity. The whole religion is based on the dying son who will die for our sins but he does not even mention it! so God sacrificed himself to himself so human kind can go back to heaven as the sin of Adam made us unholy. God does not want to forgive the sin of Adam, instead he sends his son ( that is him too) to be humiliated, spat on, and killed on the cross, and that the only way to forgive human kind!! It makes perfect sense !